Silver Preventing Hospital Infections And Adding To The Silver Shortage
Posted May 6th, 2008 by arizona steve
output
From: www.americanfreepress.net or www.ScienceDaily.com
Killing Germs In Hospitals, Air Ducts with Silver-Based Coating Stay Germ-Free.
September 1, 2005 — Preventing hospital infections -- from such stubborn bugs as Staphylococcus aureus -- could get a little easier with a new non-toxic, silver-based material. Used in coating, it helps keep hospital air ducts bacterium- and fungus-free. The material is also used in a number of products including athletic footwear, door hardware, pens and business supplies.
DUARTE, Calif.--For more than 6,000 years, humans have used silver to fight germs, also known as microbes. Now, some hospitals are using a silver compound to reduce hospital infections.
You can't see them, but millions of microorganisms are living quietly among us, in places where we least expect them.
Cancer patient Steve Measer worries about germs a lot. "In the last two months I have been in three separate hospitals." But at the Helford Clinical Research Hospital at City of Hope in Duarte, Calif., where he is receiving treatment, microbes are hard to find.
Dr. James Miser, Chief Executive Officer at City of Hope National Medical Center, says, "The room which we are currently standing is as free of germs as medically possible in a hospital."
This is possible because the ducts delivering air to patients' rooms are coated with a silver-based anti-microbial compound called AgION. It can kill bacteria, viruses and fungus. Jeffrey Trogolo, Chief Technology Officer at AgION Technologies, Inc. in Wakefield, Mass., says, "When the conditions are right, it turns on, and that's where the silver comes out."
Agion technologies is using silver, a centuries-old germ killer, in a unique compound to coat surfaces and instruments that could spread disease. When bacteria are detected, the compound releases silver ions to the surface, killing existing microbes and any new ones that come along. "We have virtually no organisms grown," Dr. Miser says.
It's potent enough to kill germs, but is safe to use on virtually any surface. Trogolo says, "It's less toxic than table salt and less irritating than talcum powder. Ultimately we hope this will result in less infections and actually better outcomes for the patients."
The silver compound can also kill germs in your kitchen, on shopping cart handles, even in your sneakers. It's already used in a number of products including athletic footwear, door hardware, pens and business supplies.
Besure to watch the video, as well.
This technology has been speading rapidly Worldwide and is helping to create a silver shotage.
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All hospitals would have much greater success controlling infections if they would just regularly clean out their heating/air conditioning ducts and also put portable whole house size hepa filter air cleaners in each patients room and change the filters every 90 days.
I
I was reading some of the discussion below and ironman finds it hard to believe that colloidal silver can get in your cells to actually fight cancer and viruses. What i'm asking is if it cant get into your cells how in the fuck does it make you turn blue!!! Also Ironman77's undying love and faith in the FDA immediately makes him suspect; for it has become quite apparent that the FDA has become nothing more than pill pushers.
Do you know the difference
Between Silver particles and silver Ions ? ? ?
And remember, The fact that the FDA is corrupt is not proof that Colloidal silver is works.
Show me clinical double blind studies that the stuff works, then I'll believe you, until then, I call Bullshit.
Thank You For This Well Thought out Comment
The "Iron-Head Types" throughout European history are the main reason that Western civilization remained in the "Dark-Ages" for such a long period of time. These same people were against any change, progress or the advancement of civilization. They refused to believe that the World was round, that the Sun, not the Earth was the center of our solar system, and they jailed or burned alive anyone who said otherwise. And, these types of "drags on Society" continue to push falsehoods upon us to this day, such as Columbus Discovered America, not the Vikings, the Chinese or The Knights Templar fleets. That JFK was killed by a single gunman, that two jet planes knocked down three building during 911, and that the FDA really knows what is best for the public.
I read up on the turning
I read up on the turning blue aspect a few months ago. I believe it's called argyria. Turning blue, as far as I recall, has something to do with silver's reaction to light (the reason it's used in photography) and the silver in your skin cells ends up having the same or similar reaction, changing your skin color to be grayish or blueish.
Argyria doesn't seem to be very common, from what I've read, and also seems connected with ingesting either too much colloidal silver or maybe colloidal silver that is not manufactured correctly.
Flagged
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silver...
well, there are just too many comments to go thru completely so i scanned them.
so here's one thought to consider: silver is being used in hospitals now to fight infections now for the simple reason that anitbiotics just do NOT cut it...what we are all exposed to on a daily basis and immune systems not being strong enough are the key.
colloidal silver is way more powerful and effective to combat infection. doctors are finally realizing this...it works, it always has.
why do you all think silver disappeared a while back. it was because of big pharma. silver is all natural and it works - can't have that now can we?
Bump That
Bump That
This is all a load of BS
See here - http://dermatology.cdlib....
Note the lack of quality control of the machine produced colloidal silver particle size or concentration, and the lack of any information about mechanism for silver's internal use.
Note also that the FDA HAS indeed banned over the counter colloidal silver .
Note also that some people make a great deal of money selling this.
While my ethics tell me that you are free to use what you want in your body, those that lie and commit fraud, and hide behind freedom are the biggest barrier to the RP revolution.
The Only Thing Full Of BS Around Here Is You...
The only thing full of BS around here appears to be you. You are obviously too lazy to put out any effort to investigate something that might just save your life. You probably are not aware that the middleage plaques were stopped when it was discovered that only the poor were dying and not the wealthy. They quickly realized that it was because they were eating off of silver plates, drinking from silver cups and using silver utensils. This is when the wealth began giving silver spoons to their relatives, servants and friends to suck on. This was the one thing that stopped the plague that had killed over half of the European population. And, that old say about being born with a silver spoon in their mouth was born.
There are only two types of machines, one produces macro-size particles and one produces micro-size particles. Gee, that was tough to figure out.
My understanding is that all of the electronic colloidal silver making machines have been removed from the market place but one and that is because it can produce micro-particle size silver rather than the much large macro size particle producing machines. Companies that produce macro-particle size silver are though aloud to sell their finished products in health food stores and are charging a great deal of money.
And, you are wrong again. This particular product is available at most every health food store. Micro-particle is not because of the difficulty in maintaining stratification of the extremely small sized particles..
So, how difficult was that to figure out??
You have to try and stay off of "Grand-pap's Old Cough medicine". I'm surprised that they let you drink at the home anyway.
not true
you are clearly a charlatan.
The plague was not stopped by silver, that is a complete myth. Sure silver was used as a disinfectant, but it was only moderately effective. That's a far cry from being effective with anything else. 500 years ago People used leeches for treatment, and goat bones and bleeding, it is meaningless,because none of it worked very well.
Macro and micro silver, huh, well tell me smart ass - well what are the particle sizes of each ? 100 nm, 100 um ? what is the size distribution of the particles - what percentage gets into the blood stream and is it the same for all people ? - how is it transported through the body ? is the state of the colloidal particle any different in the body, how would this effect its disinfectant ability - since it doesn't get into the actual cells in the body, how could it possible treat viruses and cancer.
As for FDA approval, it is not approved, nor is it generally recognized as safe.
See
# Fung MC, Bowen DL. Silver products for medical indications: risk-benefit assessment. Journal of Toxicology. Clinical Toxicology. 1996;34(1):119-126.
# Gulbranson SH, Hud JA, Hansen RC. Argyria following the use of dietary supplements containing colloidal silver protein. Cutis. 2000;66(5):373-374.
# FDA bans colloidal silver products, cites lack of data. FDA Consumer. 1999;33(6). Accessed at fda.gov/fdac/departs/1999/699_upd.html December 11, 2006.
A good summary of actual scientific details is here
http://www.quackwatch.org...
So full disclosure - you sell the machines right ? ?
No I Don't Sell The Machines but I wish I had Exclusive Right To
I am a 100% disabled Veteran and fully retired but if you could get me an exclusive right to market these machines I would come out retirement and hirer a good sales team to do just that. I just know that it personally worked in a big way for me and my Son and that it would do that same for most others.
I’ve never had time for old men that think they know everything and that are set in their ways, maybe it’s because they and you remind me of John McCain. I can just see you in my mind’s eye standing there in your unwashed bib-overalls with your arms crossed saying something like, “By God nobody is going to tell me anything, I’ve got it all figured out”. The good news is that you and your kind probably won’t be around much longer. America and the rest of the World need open minded people that know where to look for the real answers to real questions. Not those that just accept what the Government or the MSM tells them are true, false or a myth. I know that that particular story regarding the plague is absolutely true. Of course your low-browed ancestors probably did use goat bones, spider legs and feet of a chicken to solve their medical requirements. And, I don’t care if you or anyone else buys one of these machines, I've got my mine; in fact I particularly hope that you don’t purchase one. Silvers almost mystical healing properties have been known for over 5,000 years, in the East. India is still the largest purchaser of silver and they heal most everything with it. In the west we have only begun to discover or rediscover ancient medicines and medical practices, such as Aloe Vera, Acupuncture, Ayurveda medicine to name just a very few.
As to particle size let me again set you straight. This particular machine that I purchased, also note that I purchased one for my Son, was specifically designed to produce silver micro-particles as small as .0008 microns (i.e., eight ten-thousands of a single micron) basically invisible to the naked eye and barely visible even when you shine a laser through the solution. A comparison with the colloidal silver purchased in the store produced from standard machines allow silver particles to be seen through an electron microscope at about 20,000x magnification, the micro-particle silver that mine and thousands of other such machine produces requires a magnification of 175,000x to see the largest of the particles. Because of its micro-particle size it can easily be readily absorbed by the body.
Partial References:
Read or have someone read to you, “The Body Electric” by Dr. Robert O. Becker and Gary Selden, published in 1985, By William Morrow and Co., ISBN 0-688-00123-8, (Dr Becker was a Orthopedic Surgeon at the VA Hospital in Syracuse, New York and lead a Research Team. Read his published research on how he was able to cure “incurable” infections when nothing else would do the job and re-grow bone and tissue using silver and electro-magnetic's. Note that he wrote a second book “Cross-Currents”.
University of Wisconsin, Cancer Research Department, 2006-to present day.
Dr. Darryl See, M.D., former co-director of the Fatigue Syndrome and Fibromyalgia clinic at the University of California at Irvine.
Department of Microbiology/Molecular Biology at Brigham Young University, published 2006 in the journal “Current Science, Vol. 91, #7, October 10, 2006
Dr. Joseph Weisman, MD board of certified immunologist and assistant Clinical Professor at the University of California Medical School
Research project conducted at Nanya Institute of Technology, Chung-Li, Tao-Yuan, Taiwan. And published in the journal “Colloids Surface B Biointerfaces” October 2007
Study conducted at the Department of Physical Chemistry at Palacky University in the Czech Republic. Published in the Journal of Physical Chemistry B in August 2006.
Science Daily Magazine, 2005
Dr. Larry Ford, M.D. UCLA Medical Research, 1983
Add to the list by Doctor Frank Swartz, VA Medical Center, Phoenix Arizona. He has been a Orthopedic Surgeon for 43 years and he said that he has never seen regrowth like what ocurred in my right knee.
And the list goes on.
How to spot a huckster 101
Never believe anyone who tells you
1. I only know it does wonders for me.
2. Important information about "whatever" is being suppresed by powerful forces
3. "Whatever" was ancient secret knowledge.
As for your references - Becker is a certified quack, he has alot of other interesting beliefs about the effect of emf. Very little of his work has been replicated or even reviewed. He actually showed up on Penn And Teller's Bullshit !
The rest aren't references at all. They are people's names, you don't even say what the studies showed.
The fact is that there is no clinical study that shows that silver has a positive effect when taken internally. And it is not that hard to do such a study, you don't need huge resources. The proceeds from Beckers junk science book would have done nicely - but he won't do a real study that other people can look at - can you guess why ? No, not because it is being suppressed by the government, it is because he knows it won't work. He doesn't want close scrutiny of his claims.
So why do I care ? whether you use silver colloid or not doesn't really effect me.
- It's because it is people that pray on the gullible that turn many people away from the freedom message. I'm willing to let you sink or swim on your own, and I'd bet you are willing to take that deal as well. But to many people this would seem harsh - would you deny health care to someone so foolish as to be tricked into believing some of these things ?
Shouldn't the government help ? ? aren't they supossed to protect the least of us from these fraudulent medical predators ? And so you get an excuse for the government to oppress individuals, as with William Reich http://en.wikipedia.org/w...
For a dramatic version of what happened to him - http://www.youtube.com/wa...
I prefer we police ourselves - science is not the enemy
You Either Lack Intelligence And/Or To Lazy To Double CK Facts
Here you go again. Another case of your obvious lack of intelligence and laziness. The Doctor Becker you are refering to is Robert Becker, one of the most brilliant scientific minds of the 20th century. How brilliant you say, the U.S. Navy Research Lab contacted every famous scientist in the World but none could figure out how to be able to contact submerged submarines half way around the World and clearly communicate with them on a 24/7 basis. Finally they contacted this particular Doctor Becker, one of the the Worlds foremost authorities on Ultra-Low-Electro-Magnetic-Frequency technology. He developed a solution that the Navy still uses and is classified "Top Secret" to this day. In addition, he invented or discovered many other systems and processes, such as Bio-Rhythums and multiple frequency emitting machines that perform a number of very interesting tasks. It should be noted that much of his work is classified by the Military and intelligence agencies. Oh, and I understand from the published information that I received with by mirco-particlar colliodal silver generator, that he was indeed the inventor of this particular machine, as well.
Not only did you believe the wrong sources again but where you went really wrong is that the Doctor Robert "O" Becker that I pointed out and that wrote the book "The Body Electric", one of the greatest science books of the past 50 years or more, and a Orthopedic Surgeon and Researcher working directly for the Government through the Veterans Administration. Following the publication of his first book in 1985 and its huge popularity, the AMA and Big Pharma has done everything they could to shut down any additional studies along this line and they were somewhat successful until about five years ago.
Rear Admiral M.D. Van Orden U.S. Navy (Ret.) and Vice-President for Research at the American Paralysis Association said of this Dr. Beckers work: "This is an outstanding book by one of the true pioneers of medical research. Becker's passionate beliefs in the two-edged sword of electrical and electro-magnetic efforts on living creatures must be given credence".
But, once again, Iron-head, please don't buy one of these machines. I believe that in your case science should not interfear with the "law of Natural Selection". Nature of course uses this law to weed out various types of unwanted animals that are not progressing properly.
who cares what the guy did
Before he got caught up in a mistake that he was too arogant to recognize. Actually that happened to Linus Pauling too, and his mistakes about Vitamin C. Older scientist loose their capabilities, but don't realize it.
I made no mistake of reference, Each one is Robert O. Becker.
Big pharma has Congress in
Big pharma has Congress in their pockets. How far do you think they would go to keep something that is effective against 650+ pathogens from competing with all of their products? It's the same with marijuana, I've never touched the stuff but from what I understand it has the potential to virtually sink the pain medication industry -- big pharma doesn't want that either.
Just as long as the money keeps flowing out of your pockets and into the machine they are happy.
Bump That
Bump That
Quote from article
Quote from article above
"With the availability of more effective pharmacologic alternatives, physician-directed use of silver-containing products has significantly declined."
Cha Ching Cha Ching....
I am a health freedom advocate, I work in the health care industry and watch people shut down on a daily basis because they have an abscess or toothache or...... and they try an alternative that works for them. If you could hear the back room talk about these people once the Dr has dismissed the patient. Dr's have an agenda to keep their treatment the right treatment. Ego and $. The truth is there is always potential for fraud in ALL of medicine and the pharma boys are the biggest rapists. Most (not all) alternative approaches are modest and the body gives clues way before things go wrong. So if you are strong and healthy it's easy to discontinue. However there are great alternative health care physicians to help people and this thread is anther way to get info. Comcast had a news item about 6 months back on this guy from Eugene Oregon that had argyria. Man he was purple! This guy started taking colloidal silver in his early 30's and after 2 quarts a day and 15 yrs he started changing shades. He STILL takes daily silver but he cut back to a few daily ounces. Pretty excessive but oddly he is very healthy (his words)
Networking like we are doing here is a great way to get info and there are many on line forums that expose fraud. I visit and research every thing, THEN I bounce it of my superhuman brained naturopathic physician.
Last Note: anything the FDA does is suspect and I will never trust this organization's recommendations The FDA is pharma's pimp
Steve you mentioned below
Steve you mentioned below that your generators run 24/7. I watched the 3 minute demo and they showed a timer set at 3 hours makes 1 quart. Do you rotate your water or leave yours running longer than 3 hours or...?
It Is Important To Follow Those Instructions
You are correct, always run it based on three hour periods. What I have been doing lately is to set the timer for 21 hours for each production run. This has varied over the past year. Here again, we have a supply and demand situation. Right now I have a particular deman and so I produce the corresponding supply. I would strongly suggest that you begin at a much lower level and then build up slowly. The first week or so run the machine for periods of 3 hours at a time then possibly move up to 6 hours, then after a few more days to 9 hours, then12 hours and so on. It also depends on what you are utilizing it for. If it just general maintance, then 3 or 6 hours would be sufficient. Another good thing to do just prior to beginning use of this material is to cleanse your body really well for about three to four weeks. Material for this is found off the shelf at most any health food store. In addition, you should drink a lot of fresh, clean, filtered water to clean out your system and to keep everything moving through and out. Most people are not aware that most every person walking the Earth has approximately 2 1/2 pound of parasites living in their Colon and Small intestine. Some of these are very dangerous, especially the deadly blood fluk. You must try and physically eliminate as many of these parasites as possible. Herbs will also help such as Black Walnut, Pumpkin Seed Oil, Wormwood herb, Pau D'Arco, Cats Claw, Graviola and a number of others that they will assist you with, (Be sure to only take Cats Claw for short period of times and then stop for a week or so). Then, once cleaned out as best possible, you are good to go with the micro-particle colloidal silver producing process. The reason is that silver will kill many, if not most of these parasites sending their bodies into your Kidneys possibly causing a build up problem and possible failure of these organs. This is another reason for starting out slowly and cleansing a little over a long period of time.
Hope this helps.
God Bless
Question, Sir !
I am buying 500ppm colloidal silver at $50.00 an ounce...How do you determine the weight of suspended silver...do they have a test kit you use?
Thanks..
______________________________
"I have once heard that the ability to resist temptation is the truest measure of a mans character."
Dustin Hoffman to Steve McQueen
"Papillion"
I Wouldn't Purchase That Product - Here's Why
First of all, the key importance is not on the ppm because you can produce a prodcut containing far more than that if you wish but the key importance is the particle size that you end up with. The products sold in health food stores all contain macro (large) size particles. The reason that this product is sold and not the machines that produced them is because the FDA would not approve such a machine. The only such machine that I could locate on the market that produces micro-particle size colliodial silver just happens to be FDA approved and I believe that it is made in California and one company does distribute them here in Arizona. Sure, you can suck on a silver spoon as many Europeans did during the middle age plagues and get great results. What I like about the micro-particle size machine producers is that the product produced is approximately the size of a human cell and some of the product is even smaller. Human cells and cancer cells both share the need for moisture. A cancer cell has three outter layers containing moisture in between each layer. As a retired aerospace research engineer I rightly or wrongly surmized that if the cancer cell takes on moisture containing micro-particle silver it very well may kill the cancer cell from the inside out. I call it my Battle of Troy approach. I can tell this, the University of Wisconsin is presently experiment with direct injections of silver particles into cancerous tumors and are having good results. What size particle they are using is unknown to me but I would bet that they are micro-particles.
In addition, $50 for an once of this material is robbery. My machine cost me $250 and I produce about a quart a day. Now, having said this let me say that the reason you won't see micro-particle silver sold in health food stores is because it only stays statified within the distilled water for a few days and will fall to the bottom of the jar if close to electro-magnetic devices or if left in direct sun light.
I recall reading somewhere a
I recall reading somewhere a while back that hospitals use various silver-based cleaning supplies in order to better disinfect, etc. This new use of silver seems like a logical progression. Some company is also designing silver catalytic converters (replacing the palladium), which will save a lot of money as compared to the other metal.
Regarding the potential for a silver shortage, I suppose its possible. 95% or so of silver use is industrial and those companies have a very real need for the metal. My guess is that industry would be willing to pay nearly whatever they needed to in order to get the required silver for their products (cell phones, computers, other various electronics, medical use, etc).
Bump That
Bump That
Forget the scare headlines
While you describe a real and legitimate use of silver, say that it's "causing shortages" is nonsense. You can buy all the 100 oz bars of silver you want, there are no shortages. (The U.S. mint underestimated the popularity of silver coins, so there has been a temporary shortage of silver in coin form. That should not be confused with a shortgage generally.)
do you follow the cot's or
do you follow the cot's or watch the etf's? no... i see you don't.. i'll bet you any amount you want that if you wanted to buy 300,000.00 worth of silver in any form you would have a hard time getting all of it within 2 months! for a bar here or a bar there sure.. there is someone always wanting or needing to sell but to buy in bulk it ain't gonna happen!
Okey dokey
I'll happily bet any amount you want but you'll have to lend me the $300,000 to do the buying. (You'll get it back in the form of silver bars.)
Again, raising the cash is more likely to be a problem than buying the silver. Industry uses tons of the stuff and yet I haven't seen them bid it up to $60 an ounce yet.
By contrast, when platinum mines in South Africa lost power because of the incompetence of their government and had to cease operation, platinum prices spiked up over 20% in a few days. There really was a shortage. (Prices have since slid down, suggesting that even there the supply fears exceeded the reality.)
It's very simple, boys and girls. If the big consumers in industry aren't suddenly facing big increases in prices for some commodity they need, then there is no evidence for a shortage.
The government doesn't care if the price of platinum spikes
because nobody uses the price of platinum as an inflation indicator.
___________
Lisa C.
http://www.women4ronpaul....
The government doesn't care if the price of silver spikes
The government doesn't care if silver spikes either. It may take a glance at the price of gold, but the CPI is calculated on the basis of stuff that ordinary people actually buy -- like clothes, gas, rent and electronic toys. (I'll readily agree that the CPI calculation is manipulated to the point of meaninglessness. My biggest gripe is that my biggest single expense -- taxes -- is not included at all. And taxes always go up.)
You Hit The Nail On The Head
Good Thinking
What The Hell Is Wrong With You, Are You Drunk??
You just made my arguement for me, Bob. If I just pointed out a very real and an increasingly large potential Worldwide use for this mineral it will by diffinition increase the overall demand for the product. Therefore, higher demand and less supply will result in much higher prices. Obviously, you know that or you wouldn't be buying small amounts of silver each month.
Incidently, how knowledgeable were you when silver was $4.35 per once?? I'll bet that you didn't buy one once. Having built three metal foundries, worked as a senior metals research engineer for Northrop and as a owner of a gold and silver mine myself, I new when to purchase close to $100,000 worth of silver and I won't sell one once until it reaches $150 per once. Just like the previous run up in silver. I bought in a $1.29 per once from the Federal reserve Bank in San Fransico and sold at $52 per once. Bob, I don't know what Government disinformation that you have read, but in this case you are flat wrong and you don't know what you are talking about. I suggest that you stop drinking and sober up.
It sure is fun..
..to see people fly off the handle when you don't agree with them 100%.
The head post described some increasing uses of silver for disinfectant purposes. Fine. It gave no estimates of actual projected demand for these new products. So I really think it's premature to insist these new uses will cause a shortage. Is this new use of silver going to exceed any increase in mining production? Maybe, but no one here has provided any numbers at all to show that that is the case. Are we talking about 100 tonnes of year of new demand, 1000 tonnes, or 10,000 tonnes? (Only the last number would clearly cause a shortage.) No one here is even coming up with an order of magnitude estimate.
Yup, silver had a big spike back in the late 70s when the Hunt brothers tried to corner the market. Then it crashed right down to $4, despite the fact that the dollar had less purchasing power in 1990 than it had in 1980.
I do own some silver and gold. I do not see it as a speculation that will make me rich, but as a hedge against an inflating dollar, and insurance against a general breakdown of society. If you were a refugee from Europe in the late 1930s it would have been very useful to have some gold to take with you. If I could predict the movement of prices I'd make my living as a futures trader.
Are You Drinking Again??
Bob, just... put..... the... bottle.... down.
Your 2+2=5 logic doesn't make any sense.
Only sober guy in this thread
If anybody is acting drunk in this thread it's you.
I'm the *only* one in this debate who offered any numbers at all for quantify of silver mined, recycled, used for jewelry, used for photography, used for investment, etc. Did anyone else offer up alternative numbers, or explain where the calculations in the Fortis report are wrong? No. Instead there were paranoid rants about how the Fortis report must be wrong because it was put out by an investment bank. There's been lots of name calling and declarations of Ted Butler as God (who in his omniscience apparently failed to warn his readers after silver exceeded $20 that it would soon fall 20%). People say I must be wrong because I haven't shown that I can buy $300,000 of silver in two months. As if they had tried themselves, and failed. You have yourself insisted that a new use of silver will cause shortages without making even a ball park estimate of the actual quantity of silver that will be used in the application.
I feel like I'm the only grown-up in a room full of 14 year olds with tin foil hats. (Hint: Grown ups do the math.) This is looking like the worst stereotype of Ron Paul supporters.
You are wrong because you're not a buyer.
I'm not talking $1000 bucks at a time BobW.
If you haven't tried to source, at a bare minimum, $50,000 then you really can't offer any advice in this area, can you?
___________
Lisa C.
http://www.women4ronpaul....
And neither are you
Lisa C., *You* haven't tried to buy $50,000 of silver lately so why are you so damned sure you can't? I will happily bet you $20,000 that I can buy $50,000 of silver in bar form. In effect you'll be paying me $20,000 to do your buying for you, and that's a pretty nice commission. You'll have to cough up the $50,000 for the buy though, and put the $20,000 in escrow for paying me my winnings. There are plenty of industrial users that buy more silver than that and strangely they haven't bid up the price to extraordinary levels.
The U.S. Commodity Futures Trading Commission agrees with me. They're the guys who put out the COT reports you folks always like to shove under my nose:
http://www.cftc.gov/files...
I especially like the way that the available stocks of silver represent seven times as many weeks of consumption as do the available stocks of lead. So if you really want to make money horde lead.
Of course I'm not so naive as to not realize that you're simply going to accuse the CFTC of being part of the conspiracy.
Funny how the US Mint never
Funny how the US Mint never "underestimated the popularity" of silver coins before --- why the sudden popularity now?
Maybe there is no shortage, per se (how exactly is one defined anyway?), but the supplies do seem to have tightened up in the last few months.
When silver shot up above
When silver shot up above $20 an ounce a lot of newsletter writers were telling people to buy. Since most people reading those newsletters get silver at the one ounce Silver Eagle level rather than buying 5000 oz COMEX bars, that caused a run on the coins.
Now if you're going to be lecturing to me about supply and demand, you should at least familiarize yourself with the basic data presented in the Fortis Silver Book. Note that the surplus of supply over demand for 2007 was 6,141 tonnes and for 2008 is forecast to be 7,315 tonnes. Even after leaving out dishording of government stocks the surpluses are 5,641 and 6,815 tonnes, respectively. Yes, demand exceeds the annual amount mined, but you shouldn't leave out of your calculations the 13,000 tonnes a year of silver that is recycled.
who puts out the fortis
who puts out the fortis silver book?? the silver users institute? I bet that fortis has something to gain by the price of silver being low!
as for me and my home, we shall worship the LORD
It's weird...
..that the people who complain about gas being too high also complain that silver is too low. If you really believe that 8 evil traders are keeping silver too low then thank them for the opportunity to buy it cheap and back up the truck. Sheesh.
DUDE! if you want to talk
DUDE! if you want to talk to an expert on this go see what ted butler says.. he'll blow you out of the water.. your wrong! end of story!
as for me and my home, we shall worship the LORD
This is where you're getting your information on the
availability of physical? A merchant bank that uses a consultant from Haliburton?
___________
Lisa C.
http://www.women4ronpaul....
My, my, aren't we being
My, my, aren't we being paranoid. Where, pray tell, do you get your information? Do you dispute the mining figures in that report? The recycling figures? The various figures for both industrial and investment demand? If you do, tell me where you got your numbers.
You're wrong.
Try to buy a paltry half million dollars worth of silver and get back to us.
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Lisa C.
http://www.women4ronpaul....
I'm right
The only difficult part would be getting the half million dollars. That much silver would definitely be an overweighting of my portfolio.
In other words, you really don't know.
If you haven't tried to source half a million (or more), how can you say you are right about the availability of silver?
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Lisa C.
http://www.women4ronpaul....
I know better than you
Because (see my other post) there was a surplus of over 6,000 tonnes of silver in 2007. To use up my hypothetical half million dollars I'd only have to buy about one of those tonnes.
if there is this much silver
if there is this much silver around why did the US mint have to purchase silver on the open market to make silver eagles.. the US government had a stock pile of 3BILLION OUNCES IN 1980.. its gone now.. so you say there is a surplus?? GO READ TED BUTLER! AFTER YOU TAKE ATLEAST A FULL DAY TO STUDY THEN COME BACK!
as for me and my home, we shall worship the LORD
You are half right
The U.S. government has gotten rid of most (or all) of its stockpile. But remember that the Fortis report showed all government dishording at about 500 tonnes, far less than the silver surplus. Indeed, even though the U.S. mint had to go to the open market to buy silver you'll note that that didn't send the silver price to the moon. That's because there's plenty of silver out there to buy.
don't mind Lisa, BobW...
she was one of those telling everyone to buy at $20 an oz...