How not to win your state convention
Posted May 12th, 2008 by RJ Harris
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In the last two major state conventions, Oklahoma and Arizona, we the Ron Paul supporters were not able to rally enough of our base to the convention—which led to us not being able to win the day in either state. There is a common thread in BOTH of these losses…we moved away from the success at the district conventions wherein we took on the neo-cons directly and instead tried the stealth approach. I was vehemently against this strategy in Oklahoma, but was overruled. The Conservative/Libertarian base of the Republican party is spoiling for a fight and in neither of these two states were we allowed to have one. I believe that this kept the more devote Ron Paulers at home instead of at the convention where their vote could have made a difference. Further, with all the stealth ops going on and no one wearing their RP gear it was very hard to coordinate votes that were mostly standup/sitdown votes. The RPers in the audience need to know who everyone else is so they know who their leadership is and how to vote. Special forces DON’T win the war, they prep the battle to your sides advantage and can gather the intel your side needs, but it is your ground pounders that are going to punch through to the goal line when the ball is on the 5 yard line.
If your state has a convention coming up…PLEASE follow Nevada’s example and take the battle to the establishment directly. Advertise to your people that this is what you are going to do so you can energize and motivate your people to show up. It is time to put on your Kevlar and get in the fight…or get back in the HUMVEE and wait for the shooting to stop.
RJ Harris
Norman Meet-up leader
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Regardless
Regardless of JG’s deliberate obtuseness in this thread I hope the majority of those who read this will take away the point that there are many within the movement that will flat refuse to show up if they are told they are supposed to infiltrate the establishment instead of being allowed to fight them fairly. Running for an office is not infiltrating and JG knows that but he cares more about being right than getting the point. You can “yea but” me all you want JG but you are not providing any answers to the solution of “get more people to the conventions.” Whereas myself and others here are saying that when we have followed a plan that called for direct action, and the troops got wind of that, they showed up to fight. What is not really clear is what you are actually arguing about. Some of the good points you made were not in contention in this thread so are you just being willfully contrarian? Why would you argue so vehemently against the idea of standing up for liberty openly and why all the derogatory comments about how stupid and wrong everyone else is except you?
You cannot hide from the fact that the last two conventions OK and AZ were defeats and both of them used stealth tactics that backfired. Any good leader can figure out that when faced with defeat adjustments must be made. I am really past arguing with you…hopefully this pointless debate has at least got some of the meet-up group leaders in states with upcoming conventions re-thinking their plan. That is the point JG, good day.
RJ Harris
Strength and Honor
Invoking Nevada again...
Most of us, especially anyone who had aspirations of being a National Delegate, went in without our RP signs and gear. We waited to see what sort of numbers we had before we showed out. By the time the convention began, we had a feel for the balance in the room and felt more comfortable being open. After passing the amended rules that made National Delegate selection fair (or so we thought at the time), many of us broke out the pins and signs and stickers. It could be that that made the NRC even more nervous and made them take the drastic action of adjourning the Convention (illegally)!
Like most things on that day, we were prepared for the best and worst scenarios (except the early adjournment which took _everyone_ by surprise!). Organization and preparedness are what win conventions. We showed up whenever it was needed - to walk precincts, make phone calls, wave signs, volunteer for local and state GOP organizations - and we were ready for whatever the day required. As you can't uncrack an egg, we went in prepared to be stealthy.
Stealth isn't bluffing. Stealth is just playing your cards close to the vest until you see the flop. How's that for a Nevada metaphor?
Kelly, Nevada delegate.
Yes Nevada Again
You may have been prepared to go stealth if you did not have the numbers, but the point is your people showed up because the man himself showed up and it does not get much more anti-stealth than that. There are those in this thread arguing against my point on the position that stealth is what you do when you don’t have the numbers. My point is that projecting that as the mode keeps people away and leads to a self fulfilling prophesy. There is nothing about the Ron Paul campaign that has been run under-cover. The whole point has been, admittedly so, to educate the American People, and in that endeavor RP has been wildly successful. Besides what is the point of sneaking in delegates to National? They would be there without a mandate. Yes I will invoke Nevada again…those delegates have a mandate because Romney dropped and the Paulies showed up strong at the conventions.
Getting conservatives/libertarians to the national convention this year is nice, but our leader has made it very clear that his stated goal is to educate the public...he has said that is why he got in the race in the first place and it is for this reason that he has not dropped. That and we keep sending his campaign the money it needs to continue. Lets not waste the impetuous of this movement on infiltration ops, lets get out there and stump honestly for our candidate and his platform issues. Lets fight openly for liberty and the constitution so that more people than ever before can be brought into this movement. Hiding in the crowd and going along to get along will not educate anyone. If we are up-front and vocal about the liberty message and we lose…then we lose on our terms and we keep spreading the message until we have an honest majority
RJ Harris
Strength and Honor
Well, you're missing something...
There are many people in this country who are not leaders or cutting edge thinkers. They will not consider an idea or a figure until it's more widely accepted. The point of getting as many delegates as possible to the National Convention is to show our strength of numbers even if we can't get RP elected.
In Nevada, delegates are not bound to a specific candidate. They can vote for whomever they wish at the National Convention. Even in some states where delegates are bound, they are only bound for the first ballot. Given the maximum possible number of delegates, we can send a message to everyone that RP's ideas are not fringe, that they are valid and applicable to our country today.
If not showing out and proclaiming oneself a RP supporter gets one elected a delegate to the National Convention, how is that bad? How is that contrary to our goal? There were many among our Revolutionary fathers who did not or could not speak out publicly, but who still acted in furtherance of the Revolution.
Or, as JG's been trying to say for months, actions speak louder than words (or signs or buttons or shirts, etc)
HAve you.....
RJ,
There are 2 weeks remaining in AZ to recruit PCs and file their papers.
In the amount of time you have been complaining on dailypaul, you could have recruited and filed papers for one or more PCs.
If you live in another state, you could have recruited one or more county central committee members.
If you are in CA, what what you done to file papers for central committee.
Tell me the state you live in and I'll get the next party filing deadlines for you and help you do something constructive instead of your eternal negative complaining on this site.
For PEte's sake man, do something!
Need Advice
jg,
Anything I can do in Florida, going it alone, as far as I know.
The convention in Nevada
I am a delegate to the Nevada State Republican Convention. I have been disappointed that our local newspapers have done very little accurate reporting on the abrupt halting of the convention. I am soliciting money for an advertisement in the local paper that tells what really happened and urges the state party to reconvene the convention at the earliest practical date. Please consider supporting this effort. For more information see the following link
http://www.nevadahomeowne...
One of the most potent weapons in our arsenal is to appeal to the sense of fairness that is present in those who are not Ron Paul supporters. That was very effective at the convention in Reno and is the goal of my proposed advertisement.
Check this out...
I hope you had a chance to see this article.
http://www.lvrj.com/opini...
You should be promoting the heck out of it.
I admit that it probably doesn't demonize the establishment GOP players as much as it should, but I don't think you are going to get better coverage out of the MSM.
Great article.
Thanks for posting this link. Needs to have its own forum topic.
I agree, there is a terrible price to pay for stealth.
We do not want to sneak in the back door.
People (including me!) do not want to be "infiltrated", "forced", "subverted", "hijacked", "diverted", etc.
We all want to feel that we have power to control our destinies.
After all, isn't that what "liberty" is all about?
In the states and conventions where we came prepared to express and defend the cause of liberty-- openly, politely, but firmly-- we have had the best outcomes. (I consider the Nevada convention to be a great victory, for example.)
The ultimate goal of the Ron Paul movement is NOT to win the nomination in September or even to win the general election in November. (Even if we succeed, if the perception of the American people was that we had "cheated" our way to victory, it would be a Pyrrhic victory that would set our movement back years.)
The ultimate goal of the Ron Paul movement is to persuade, educate, convert, and liberate the majority of the American public and restore the Republic.
I agree that Ron Paul making personal appearances (as he did at the Nevada convention) is very important.
I also agree that openly courting (NOT antagonizing!) the supporters of Romney and Huckabee is crucial to our future success.
Do you have convention experience.....
Conventions are not the place where you are going to convert people.
Conventions are the place where likeminded people elect people like them to represent them at the next party level up.
You bring your numbers and you elect people like you.
What have you done to increase RP numbers at the convention closest to you?
Have you recruited PCs, caucus goers or county central committee members?
If not, why not.
If you do not know how ASK FOR HELP AND IT WILL BE PROVIDED!
R3volution.
I have to agree. I am tired of the stealth game. I want to yell from the rooftops that I support Ron Paul. I am proud of it. I want to show it. This election has become about the future of our country. The trilateral commission had it right:
http://www.dailypaul.com/...
"The ultimate goal of the Ron Paul movement is to persuade, educate, convert, and liberate the majority of the American public and restore the Republic."
We are on a mission.
We are on a crusade.
We are Ron Paul.
We are the future.
.
No you're not....
...if you aint doing something about it.
LESS TALKING MORE ACTION.
Pardon Me?
Pardon me?
How many conventions do you have experience with....
A convention is not a place to "liberate" people. It is a place where party faithful come to elect representatives WHO ARE LIKE THEM to a convention at the next level up.
A CAMPAIGN is where you educate and inform people. When you have enough people you BRING THEM to a convention so YOU can elect people like YOU to represent you and the next level up convention.
If you don't they will. End of story.
Again, this opining from people who have ZERO convention experience but represent themselves as experts is the height of arrogance and totally unproductive.
I think you missed the point.
I have never claimed to be "an expert on the convention process". I DO know a few things about people, human nature, and persuasion. I was also not trying to claim that I know the optimal strategy for garnering the maximum number of "Ron Paul" delegates to the RNC. What I WAS stating was my opinion about what our long term goals were, and how the convention process could best serve those.
If you disagree with my opinions, you are more than welcome, regardless of your expertise.
I completely agree that you want to persuade as many people as possible during the campaign (and before the campaign and after the campaign). But to dismiss the possibility of persuading people at every step of the process is being defeatist and is ultimately counterproductive.
For example, my wife volunteered to help a long time GOP activist in his quest to be elected to the Iowa GOP central committee. She made phone calls to his list of district convention delegates and (with his full knowledge and consent) put in a plug for her own RNC delegate candidacy. (He did win, by the way.)
In the process she had excellent response from the vast majority of the delegates she spoke with, gained valuable credibility, gained name recognition, accumulated some political currency with her "mentor", and generally laid the foundation for becoming at least a small factor in Iowa GOP politics.
She has become a member of the county Republican women's clubs for two counties. When we went to the district convention we went out to eat dinner with a couple she had "met" through her phone banking. We're sending them a copy of "Revolution: Manifesto".
Even if these had been just random voters, her time would have been well spent. The fact that these are people who are very active, donating their time and money to promoting candidates and issues within the GOP makes her efforts invaluable. (Especially in Iowa, an early caucus state.)
True, she could have spent her time, instead, hanging out in Meetup groups complaining about the "sheeple" who just don't "get it", and strategizing on how to "steal" the convention.
I think she chose wisely.
Perhaps....
I think what your wife did was exactly right on target. That's what I did too and I ended up becoming a vice chair in the county party!
If all RP Republicans engaged at that level from the beginning, we would be having a brokered convention right now.
Oklahoma's convention
had some other problems too: http://www.coupbymemo.com....
If you want to win these conventions, folks, make sure you get EVERYONE you can there. Not just your buddies around town, but find people from rural areas too. These people might be under the impression that RP dropped out or may not be connected to RP supporters in the same way we city folk are.
This would have been especially effective in Oklahoma, because each county gets a certain amount of votes based on the number of delegates it has been approved for. If a county gets 100 votes, and one delegate actually shows up, that person's vote is worth 100 votes. Check and see if that's the rule or not in your state. And if it is, get these small town RP-ers to the convention.
One other thing you can do that may have turned the tide in Oklahoma: I know when the vote for convention chairman goes down, everybody's not really awake yet, but STAND YOUR GROUND on the convention chair vote. If it's close, DEMAND a rollcall vote.
Of course it was the numbers......
In NV we had over 40%. In AZ, we had fewer than 8% + another less than 30% of unorganized anti-McCain anti-Ron Paul delegates.
Then among those people broke ranks and didn't vote for the anti-McCain slate (i.e. split our votes). Nominations from the floor all over the place. People showing up late for credentialling. Too few volunteers who showed up on time.
If everyone showed up and did what they needed to do on queue without splitting the votes and if we had another 10-20 state delegates it would have been a very different story in AZ.
The #1 challenge in AZ was not what happened at the convention, it was for the 14 months the campaign staff encouraged people to become PCs, the "grassroots" (who really aren't the grassroots but a tiny minority of vocal complainers among all of the supporters) yelled that the campaign was "oppressing the grassroots" by trying to get them to forego signwavings to become PCs and attend their district meetings so they could become state delegates.
Well, we got the outcome in AZ that was consummate to the input that was put in.
Same in NV. The NV supporters worked their ***es off doing the RIGHT things that win conventions. The AZ supporters, while (mostly) all good, dedicated people and true patriots didn't get it done.
But we are not giving up.... There is currently a challenge for each existing Ron Paul Republican PC in AZ to recruit *10* more each!
Even if we get half that we can take over the entire state party in less than 2 years AS LONG AS EVERYONE STICKS AND ALWAYS SHOWS UP NO EXCUSES.
The same person that
The same person that coordinated Nevada also coordinated AZ. It had to be the #'s
I second what RJ said
I second what RJ said. You can say
we didn't have the numbers in Arizona,
but the key is in getting that disaffected 50 %
of Romney, Huckabee supporters to vote
for Ron Paul.
*
*
It sounds like for this to happen in Nevada
it took two things. 1) a speech by Ron Paul
2)Everyone full out wearing their Ron paul
colors.
Romney and Huckabee supporters are not
going to stick their necks out if all the Ron
Paul supporters are in stealth mode. They
are however willing to join a large and vocal
groups of people.
Are you in AZ?
Do you know AZ politics at all? I bet not.
Redirect
Your right JG, living in Arizona for most of my adult life…how could I possibly know anything about Arizona politics. I only moved to Oklahoma recently to finish up my undergraduate degree at OU when our beloved institutions in Arizona failed to recognize any of the college credits I received from 18+ years of Army education.
Naturally, being so long tied to Arizona I have been following your results as closely as possible because there is a real possibility I will be returning soon to go to ASU Law in August. In the mean time I have been active in the Oklahoma Ron Paul movement and delegate selection process. If I do return to AZ this summer I hope I find the other Ron Paulies a little more courteous than you. The point of this post was not to address Arizonans anyway, It was to tell other states coming up the FACT that the last two states that tried to go stealth at their conventions lost and to encourage them to get ready for a fight. Many of our people are hard core anti-establishment types and have no desire to spend the time and effort going to a convention so they can join the establishment even if it is in stealth mode.
If we win I want it to be because we stood up for Ron Paul and Constitutional Government, if we lose I want everyone to know that we went down swinging. And I want the establishment seeing us swinging with all of our might because that sends them the message that we are fed up with their RINO candidates and we are not going to take it anymore. It also sends a message to those just finding out about Ron Paul or those on the fence that there are others like them that are willing to stand up and maybe they will be energized by our tenacity even in a temporary defeat. JG please don’t take offence to this thread, learn from it.
RJ Harris
Strength and Honor
Don't make false assumptions......
RJ,
You have drawn a conclusion on a false assumption, that the 8% of the delegation who were Ron Paul did NOT go down swinging. You are WRONG.
As far as being courteous goes, that is irrelevant. The convention is about numbers. You bring it or you don't. No amount of courtesy will help you beat the McCain or GOP machine.
So, RJ, I assume that when you get to AZ, you will become a PC and run each year for either State Committeeman or State Delegate.
Thanks.
Numbers
I was a delegate in AZ. We simply didn't have the numbers.
We needed a lot more PC's and didn't have them. Simple math. Your not going to win by yelling loudly at the convention.
We need a RP Donor list to go door to door recruiting PC's. We have over 1000 available slots just in Maricopa county. We need about 500 throughout the whole state and we will never lose again. SIMPLE.
Yes
I agree we need more numbers and the way to get them is not by blending in but by standing out, standing out the way Ron Paul does... where the people can see us fighting for the Constitution and against the establishment. I have noticed that it is very hard to motivate people to go to a convention to hide.
RJ Harris
Strength and Honor
So say you.....
Again you draw conclusions based on false assumptions.
In this case you assume that standing out will always draw a greater response than not.
The truth is that SOME people respond to standing out. Some people who otherwise would convert to RP DO NOT.
This "one size fits all" national "expertise" of yours is very arrogant and extremely counterproductive.
jg
RJ Harris` points are valid I believe. Your way of course would be the logical way to do things but its too late in the game to do it your way. Doing your way will just be AZ all over again...everywhere.
Silly.....
How in the world can you exrapolate one way to 50 states?
That's the problem with national "experts", they are not experts. They are theoretists.
Each state is different and you should calculate in the experience of long time GOP operatives in each state who are hard core, uncompromising RP supporters.
Unless you just want to run your troops into the well organized machine guns, which is what many of the brash and inexperienced here believe wins hearts and minds.