A VERY IMPORTANT READ!!! JURY DUTY *We the people hold the power* (Citizens rule book)
Posted June 14th, 2008 by Americandodo
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You know, I have been thinking, and I don't know if this issue has already been addressed here on dailypaul, but if it hasn't, I will do so.
As you know Ron Paul and the Campaign for Liberty are pushing forward to get constitutional minded folks in political offices around this great country. The idea being change from the ground up, change from the lowest offices in politics to the highest. This is a brilliant plan I might add, but what this forum post is about is jury duty, yes good old jury duty.
So, I was thinking about this the other day (because I got a paper in the mail saying I have jury duty), and at first I was kinda bummed.....don't lie, nobody wants to take their precious time to go do jury duty..........Then it hit me......a juror has more power than ANYONE in this whole country. A juror MAKES or BREAKS laws. For example, I personally don't think marijuana should be illegal, but how many folks are arrested and do jail time for this.........MANY.....but not if I was a juror. I thought about this, and I realized, that it IS my duty, and I figured I could go in there with constitutional principles on my mind, and if the defendant didn't infringe on anyone else's rights, I say I will vote him not guilty. And seeing as how my one little voice of the 12 jurors say not guilty, that law that was supposedly broke in the first place is null and void.......the defendant goes home due to a hung jury....a free man walks.
So what I am asking all of you is this....think about it...when you go in for jury duty, and I am sure many of you do, go in with one thing on your mind......the constitution. Go in there, and think to yourself, did this defendant actually break a law. In my mind, the way I see it, as long as you don't hurt anyone, don't steal from anyone, or don't put anyone else's life at risk, I say you are clearly pursuing your own happiness......whatever that may be. It is only a crime if there is a victim...right? And even if there is a victim, remember to make sure that you hold in mind the defendant is still INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY WITHOUT A SHADOW OF A DOUBT! Weigh all the facts, and do NOT be intimidated by a judge, as a juror, you have more power than the judge.
Here are some links to empower you jurors, they are links to The "Citizens Rule Book" a masterpiece of a little pocket book!
This first one is a PDF (I will give two PDF links due to the fact I am not sure if they are the same) I will also (last link) give a website so you don't have to use a pdf program to read it if you don't want to.
Anyway, if we want to change this country from the ground up, I say let's do it, but why not start where it matters, in the court room where laws are put to the test, where lives sit in the jury's hands. If we can rid unconstitutional laws as jurors, then we as an individual can make a difference. Regardless who we have making the laws we the people can break those laws (the unconstitutional laws), and remain free at all times. Imagine a world where at least one of the twelve jurors were a Ron Paul minded freedom lover....think about it...we would all be free again, and that is without a politician change. We could have our country back,.....for the most part....one trial at a time.
Well, I hope I made some sense out of this. Stand tall, be heard, and never back down from what is right. Also if anyone already previously posted something along these lines, I didn't mean to step on any toes, I just want our free people to be educated, and informed.
God bless you all, and God bless America!
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Never forget
Fortune Favors the Bold
As a juror, YOU have the option of nullification. They don't tell you this when you go in for jury training. In fact, on the one occasion I went for jury duty, at the training, when the traimer asked "Any question?" I asked point blank if the jury had the right to, based on their conscience, nullify the law and deliver a not guilty verdict contrary to judge's instructions of the considerations of the case. Boy was he pissed! His answer: "Yes, but I really wish you hadn't brough that up, because that's exactly what we don;t want to hapen here today."
Oh man I would have loved to see his face
I bet you made that guy pissed, and shocked at the same time. He was probably thinking,,,,someone actually knows their rights....oh no! HAHAHA
Way to go!!! I wish all jurors would know the truth, then we could get some real work done......of course we would also need everyone to plead not guilty......that would really throw our system off =D
"Live for nothing, or Die for something" ~ Rambo
Haha, what a creep!
Did you nullify anyways??
I have to bump this....
I know this is my forum post, but I strongly feel it is important for people to know the power of the jury. So, I will be bumping this from time to time so people can read the "Citizens rule book". Please don't think less of me for bumping my own post, I know it may seem childish, but I assure you it isn't, this is an important subject. Maybe my writing is unbearable, and if that is the case, someone with better writing skills, re write what I posted in a more user friendly post. It is the message, not the messenger that is important....remember that.
God bless!
"Live for nothing, or Die for something" ~ Rambo
Important info before you sign yourself into their jurisdiction
I just came across this:
http://originalintent.org...
Jury Summons Response Letter Overview
This jury summons response letter has been used successfully by Americans who are unwilling to sign any government document without knowing what sneaky politicians and government lawyers are trying to rope them into. In the case of the Los Angeles County Jury Summons, their goal is to get you to confirm that you are a 14th Amendment citizen. If you are unaware as to why that may well be an inaccurate admission [made under penalty of perjury] for you, read http://www.originalintent...
To date, this jury letter has had a 100% success rate at stopping the jury summons process concerning the Citizens who have used it in LA County. This is because the government does not want you to know what the "legal terms" they are using really mean.
People using this letter in counties other than Los Angeles, and in a state other than California, will have to alter the specifics accordingly, however we caution you against changing the meat of the text.
This letter is posted to insure that all Americans have a clear understanding of the meaning of the legal terms used within documents their government attempts to require them to sign, especially under penalty of perjury, and is not intended to discourage jury duty. However, if you choose to partake in jury duty, we encourage you to exercise your inalienable right to act as a Fully Informed Juror and determine both the LAW and the FACTS for yourself.
Editor
View the Jury Summons Response Letter here:
http://originalintent.org...
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"What is the task of higher education? To make a man into a machine. What are the means employed? He is taught how to suffer being bored."
-- Friedrich Nietzsche
Engage if you want--but be aware that it is enforced criminally
"Another crime backed up by the police force is jury selection.
When a prospective juror is told to appear at the courthouse, he receives a threat of arrest. The threat usually comes in the mail, but if the individual is bold enough to disobey the order to appear at the courthouse, police officers might kidnap him and put him in jail." - Roy Halliday
Educate, Educate, Educate!!!!!!
I have written about this here and blogged about it in the past. The real power is in the Grand Jury. I will be serving in the Grand Jury in December of this year, and after studying I found that the choices made there can override the executive branch, unfortunately one case at a time. I wrote that what we really need is literature to be passed out to those that serve to better understand their roles.
My father who served on the grand jury on multiple occasions was to give warrants to officers for arrests in multiple cases, half way through the day the D.A. came in and told them that if they would grant warrants for the next 5 cases quickly they could go to lunch early, and when they returned perhaps close the case load up for the day and get an early out, justice at its finest
The issue is that the D.A. can come in and say that suspect one was caught in possession of a small amount of marijuana and we caught him dead to rights, but then they go on to tell the jury that they think this may be the individual that is selling dope to the third graders at the local school, but they have no evidence of this. So it is the jury’s responsibility to make sure they nail him to the wall. The selling of dope at the school was simply made up and ensures that the jury has a bad taste in their mouths against the individual, this is happening all over the country. This should be at the very core of the Campaign for Liberty to educate the masses to their roles as jurors, as presently there is none.
Our so called peace keepers were not put in place to fine people for profit, and yet our so called justice system has turned into just that. Across the country we have found that the state highway patrol has at times been ordered to hit their quotas, although this clearly violates the constitution. Education is the only key to override the laws that directly violate the constitution.
I will be reporting on the cases heard in December and the outcomes. It would definitely be nice to hand out pamphlets to the other jurors so that they knew that their role is to support and decide via the constitution and not a D.A. that is looking for a good record to be able to take the bench in the future. With the courts put in their proper place, and the police on notice that unconstitutional actions will not be tolerated, I think that there will be many that feel safer to protest, and in the very least stand up for their constitutional rights.
The police will say that we are trying to make it easier for criminals to be released, but I see it as making sure before someone’s life is ruined, that they are in fact guilty and not an easy target for an overzealous D.A.
This has happened to a family member of mine that was guilty of giving someone a ride home because they were drunk. The drunken individual asked her to stop and got out, said she would be right back and disappeared across a parking lot. The drunk broke into another girl’s car and grabbed her CD player face as well as a box with 200 CD’s. She came back to the car and told said family member that they were hers and she had retrieved them from a friend’s car. She took her home and thought all was well. In several days a detective contacted her and asked her what had happened, she told the truth. They went after the drunk and upon questioning the drunk said that she did not know anything about the theft, and since my family members car was on video in the lot she was charged at age 17 with felony theft of property. No evidence other than the thief telling them she was not there. The D.A. was more than content to prosecute my family member and basically ruined her life for hopes of another notch in his belt, and her only offense was taking a drunk home to ensure public safety. What a legal system…..
In the beginning of a change the patriot is a scarce man, and brave, and hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot.
~Mark Twain
Reminds me of a Furry Freak
Reminds me of a Furry Freak brother's cartoon. Remember them? They are riding along in a car with a guy and a dog in the back seat. A cop stops them and the guy in the back seat says "Fuck YOU pigs. Sic him Fang"..then they all end up in jail and the one brother says "I told you not to pick up that hitchhiker"...
Regardless, I think more about this jury nullification thing needs to be brought up, now that I have an inkling as to what it is...I saw something here about it the other day, but I am afraid I didn't pay enough attention.
I agree EDUCATE, EDUCATE, EDUCATE!!!!!!!
You know I have had several friends in the same, or similar situations as the 17 year old family member of yours. Sometimes things look bad, but the whole picture needs to be seen to judge. I really hope everything works out for her, it is sad to see a young person scarred for something they didn't do.
I hope to hear about your experience on the grand jury in December, you will have to let us know how that went.
God Bless ya!
"Live for nothing, or Die for something" ~ Rambo
Good Idea
Your idea is great if you have the opportunity. Look at how the government make their case in most instances. They actually bribe witnesses to testify either with a lesser sentence. Recall Sammy "the bull" Gravano who murdered many people but was whisked away in the Witness Protection Agency. What is the problem with this? First, they are breaking the Federal law for bribery (18 USC Section 201(c)(2)). This law forbids anyone from bribing for the purpose of testimony by offering anything of value to that witness for his testimony. This is still going through court and hopfully to the Supreme Court soon. The Habeous Corpus ruling gives me hope.
Nice thought...
however, I have been on two jury's and the jury members do not have the privelege of interpeting the constitution. The jury only has the decision of whether or not the state made their case. The second jury I served on was to try a nurse that over prescribed medication to a child that was hyper active as hell with severe behavior problems. After over-prescribing meds to the child to calm him down..the boy fell and hit his head and was injured. The nurse had a public defender that was horrible! The prosecutor was a beautiful young woman that was very good and very prepared. It was a slam dunk The young nurse was focred to work a double shift and had worked over 80 hours that week including that day...a 16 hour day. Most of us on the jury felt that the care facillity was also to blame. I expressed my views to the jury and to the judge. In issuing a verdict grey area is removed..it is black and white..guilty or not guilty. Justice is not what it seems. The young nurse was found guilty, sent to prison, her career is gone and her life is destroyed. I tried to resist but eventually the other jurors won me over...they wanted to go home...I regret my decision to this day. I was weak and did not stand firm. I wish I could have that day back. I don't believe I did the right thing. My sister just graduated from nursing school and now works in a hospital for terminal seniors. She often works 3 days straight with little rest. I am haunted.
Completely not true...
"The jury only has the decision of whether or not the state made their case."
Like most of our history this is a complete misconception. Juries not only have the right to decide the facts of the case, but they have the right to determine the law. If they do not like the law -- they find not guilty. There has been much debate about this in the courts; the outcome = juries have the right, but they don't have to be told they have that right.
Go to the Fully Informed Jury Association... an excellent resource:
http://www.fija.org/
Jury nullification exists. I have served as a juror
on a state criminal trial in Texas. On one count, where the state had proven its case, to the exclusion of a reasonable doubt, the jurors did vote, after much discussion, to return a verdict of not guilty because they did not think that the law should not be applied to a given individual. How do I know? I was there. I engaged in the discussion and fully agreed with the outcome. Some people call it jury lawlessness, but it does exist, I have seen it, heard it and I have participated in it and have no doubts whatsoever regarding the correctness and just nature of the decision reached at that time and in that case. It is indeed true that a judge will tell jurors that they are the judges of fact only; that he or she (the judge) will deliver the law to them and that they must follow it. Lawyers are generally not permitted to introduce the subject, but that doesn't keep an informed juror from educating his or her peers. Jury nullification is a very old and recognized principle in our courts. Our history is filled with instances of jury nullfication as well as strong legal footing for the principle. In 1972, a D.C. Circuit Court of appeals noted: "unreviewable and irreversible power [of the jury] to acquit in disregard of the instruction of the law given by the trial judge. The pages of history shine upon instances of the jury's exercise of its prerogative to disregard instructions of the judge"
Justice Harlan Stone of the U.S. Supreme Court: (1941-1946) has said: "The law itself is on trial quite as much as the case which is to be decided" "If a juror feels that the statute [law] in any criminal offence is unfair, or that it infringes upon the defendant's natural God-given unalienable or Constitutional rights, then it is his duty to affirm that the offending statute is really no law at all and that the violation of it is no crime at all - for no one is bound to obey an unjust law"
The first U.S. Supreme Court Chief Justice John Jay has said: "The jury has the right to judge both the law as well as the fact in controversy"
Justice Samuel Chase has opined likewise, stating: "The jury has the right to determine both the law and the facts". But they are certainly not alone. Justice Oliver Wendell Holmes has also observed: "The Jury has the power to bring a verdict in the teeth of both law and fact".
Jury nullification is a reminder that the right to trial by one's peers affords those members of the public an opportunity to take a dissenting view about the justness of a statute or official practices and to nullify the state's ability to apply that statue in a given case if the jurors should so decide. Looking back into our country's history, one can recall that, in 1734, a jury refused to convict John Peter Zenger of seditious libel. This is probably the most oft quoted case by those who favor the concept of jury nullification. Over the years, the "right" has been viewed as more of a "power" of a jury and, in contemporary times, judges will do whatever they can to keep the concept from the ears, and therefore the consideration, of uninformed jurors. For instance, a 1969 decision, U.S. v. Moylan, by the 4th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals, affirmed the right of jury nullification, but also upheld the power of the court to refuse to permit an instruction to the jury to this effect. As mentioned, an informed juror cannot be prevented from educating his or her fellow jurors. Since 1988, the federal courts have attempted, with some success, to introduce jury instructions attempting to tell jurors that they do not have the power to judge the law. It has worked in most instances, even though it is not true. They have even gone so far as to make rules that would allow exclusion of any person, from a jury, who "might" be inclined to engage in jury nullification, via Federal Rules of Criminal Procedure 23(b). Again, and with uneducated jurors, they have had some success in this regard. The issue has not reached the supreme court in a substantive fashion since the trend of the late 80s, but they cannot stamp out knowledge or history. We were given the same instructions in the early 90s but, as jurors and as citizens, we ignored them when we believed the law to be wrong or that its application represented an injustice.
If you have found some source that purports to tell you that jurors have no power to judge the suitability of a law, then you've been badly misinformed.
WOW! It looks like someone did their homework!
Great comment, and thank you for sharing some very useful and encouraging facts! Patriots like yourself are a huge asset in this revolution! We need to be more informed than those we oppose.
"Live for nothing, or Die for something" ~ Rambo
Jury members do have the
Jury members do have the right to evaluate the law that the defendant is being accused of breaking to make sure that it is Constitutional. It is called jury nullification.
Well, redeem yourself by
helping others to stand their ground, and don't give in to the other jurors. I can imagine the pressure forced on you by the other jurors, but as you say , your "haunted" by this still. I guess what it boils down to is this, people like you who are experienced in this can help people by telling them to live with no regrets, even if it is a tough road. You can be a teacher due to your lessons learned (if you know what I mean).
Thank you for your comment, and sharing a past experience so that we may learn.
"Live for nothing, or Die for something" ~ Rambo
It can be hard to get on a jury.
Husband has been called several times, but never selected. One time he was called up the trial was about an automobile accident. Anyone in the jury pool who had studied physics was eliminated, so he was dismissed. Courts like ignorant jurors because they are more easily beguiled and led.
What happens
What would happen if I just played dumb to begin with? And throughout the trial acted as if I were just some sheep? I have never been on a jury yet, and I have been a registered voter for 12 years now. I am curious to how the selection works and if I can just act as if I am a fool, so they will select me.
Thanks for the comment
"Live for nothing, or Die for something" ~ Rambo
We have been deliberately mislead
about jury duty, and an immediate education is in order. It isn't a matter of being a juror and making decisions based on the constitution, but one also needs to get a copy of the penal code of their individual states as well as their state's individual constitutions. You would not believe the number of laws being broken by the police, judges and or courts all in the name of expediency. We have many areas that need to be tackled, but the R3volution cannot go forward without educating ourselves with the basic laws as well.
I agree
You know, as a juror, you can change ANY law, however, I agree 100% with you about knowing the penal code, and local ordnances. If we knew laws better, we could hold police, judges, and officials accountable. We could citizen arrest, or put in complaints against them.
Thanks for the comment
"Live for nothing, or Die for something" ~ Rambo