CEASE FIRE: A plea for civility within the Liberty Movement (On Barr, Baldwin, and moving forward in a mature fashion)

fight all they want it is good practice for when the time comes and we are in the streets yelling and screams for justice. Peace

Guys,

The plan is still in progress. The Delegates will receive their DVDs and Saint Paul will be Painted Ron Paul. Ron Paul will OWN Saint Paul, so we might yet get the nomination, these discussions about Bar and Bald, are a bit premature.

If you haven't seen it, go to "Paint Saint Paul RON PAUL" and see why the Convention will BELONG to Ron Paul. http://www.dailypaul.com/...

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www.dvds4delegates.com

if the people in DC do not act on the Congressional Hearings that took place yesterday http://tinyurl.com/629hog I think the only alternative is to storm the GOP Convention and grab Shrub and have the trial right there...hows that for civility?

Bruce Fein remarked that Bush hung himself by remarks he made on TV and radio by arrogantly flouting the law, thats the ammo for immediate impeachment with no further hearings,period.

Bruce Fein Former Associate Deputy Attorney General
Reagan Admin. 1981-82 Absolutely Brilliant Man

Paper Ballots,Hand Counted At The Precinct Or Bust

not in the sense that they are wrong but they are physically misplaced. Some of us pleaded with DPers to unite when countless hours and energy was being wasted in...

...December, when threads were dominated by fights over the Campaign's launching of a New Year's moneybomb right after December 16th's. How productive does that fight seem now?

...January & Feb, when threads were dominated by organizing wars against the media and Diebold and outing the "trolls" who didn't support those wars. How productive does the "Ron Paul really won New Hampshire" fight seem now?

...March through May, when threads were dominated by an effort to commandier the RNC for Dr. Paul, as if stealing the nomination would help and not hurt the liberty movement.

I've spent 10 hours a week for 13 years in the liberty movement, trying to BUILD our base. I've been a precinct Captain and a big donor for Ron Paul. My latest effort is here, super short videos NOT for DPers, but for us to send to sheeple. But it's DP, so a thread like this has little appeal vs Barr fights and Bilderbergs. A scant few were interested.

http://www.dailypaul.com/...

- Joe P

The Daily Paul is Dedicated to restoring Constitutional Goverment and I will do that anyway I can. If I feel like Barr is doing just that, I will promote it here, there and everywhere.

I think that the MOST important thing in this election will be the message sent (hopefully) from a large portion of the populace that we will no longer accept the status-quo, two party system. That we have begun thinking "outside the box" that the powerbrokers have kept us in. That their game is OVER.

The race for President is only one part of the equation. The entire congress needs to be replaced in order to get rid of all of the "owned" and corrupt members who are literally selling the country down the drain to the highest bidder. This would send a HUGE message that we are on to their game and that WE are now going to be changing the rules.

SO, I think that those of us here that have awakened to the tyranny that we are living under must make, as our first priority, to - of course - vote for the candidates that we feel will stick most closely to the Constitution and Bill of Rights. This would be in congress as well as for the presidency.

But, secondly, in any positions that are "up for grabs" where neither candidate really rings our chimes, I think the battle cry must be to vote for the NON-INCUMBENT, no matter which party is involved. The point being to REPLACE the long term Washington insider with fresh blood.

If we could manage to bring in ALL NEW PEOPLE to Washington (even though some of them will not be perfect), we would be eliminating YEARS of work by the evil ones in establishing corrupt relationships, and having politicians in their pockets. They would have to begin from scratch, and in the meantime, many constitutional candidates would be in place to help guide the NEW government in the right direction.

So, in a nutshell, FIRST you vote for a GOOD candidate.... and if there are no good candidates to chose from for your congressional or senate seats, then just make it a rule to vote for the NON-INCUMBANT. Lets CLEAN HOUSE!

Excellent post

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Penndel Borough needs to step up and eliminate the crime they've created by not paving and maintaining Robbins Avenue
http://will86aber.wordpre...

We do not have time for all of this infighting over stupid stuff. We are all intelligent, well-informed people or we would not be here. So, if you are interested in Barr, go for it. If you are interested in Baldwin, go for it. But, don't preach it here. We are here to promote liberty and take back our country, not to promote a particular candidate. If we promote anybody, it is RON PAUL. All of this promoting this one or that one or even an opinion about 9/11 is such a waste of energy. Let's keep each other informed on world events and the ways we can make a difference. Time is so short.

Healthnut4freedom

"Trust in the Lord with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding. In all thy ways acknowledge Him, and He shall direct thy paths." Proverbs 3:5,6

I agree with this article. We need to keep in mind that neither Barr nor Baldwin are the enemies. We are in this fight together long after the 2008 presidential election so let's try to practice a little civility and respect for everyone's opinions. Also keep in mind, the great feature of this site is that if you disagree with a thread topic you do not need to read it...I love that feature because I've seen many topics I personally disagree with so I make the rational decision to avoid those threads while giving others the freedom to comment on the particular issue.

I realize that my post about the 'Barr Spammers' probably was the catalyst for creating this post, and I would like to offer a rebuttal. Your post is well thought out and well written, and I actually spent some time thinking about each of your points. I think that in an ideal world, you would be mostly correct in your views, but due to the fact that our 'enemies' (meaning the neocon establishment and their supporters) are insidious, cunning, and shrewd, it is obvious that we DON'T live in an ideal world. Unfortunately, the methods I've employed are necessary in order to reveal the true nature and motives of a few posters here at the DP whom I FULLY believe are full time employees of the neocon camp, sent here to the DP to distract, confuse, and divide the true patriots of this all important Revolution. It has been proven that these guys operate under multiple screen names, and change them regularly when they get caught, exposed, and blackballed. To prove my point, here's a couple of quotes from BillyDee (who I believe to be the same guy as bedr1, preferred, bedr1, onevoice, minichrist, JFEJ004, and others)

"I change my username every week or so. When you think I'm gone in a few days, I'll actually still be here under another name. I like keeping people on their toes. I may actually start changing it daily." Billydee

"Trust is Irrelevant".Billydee

These guys have no integrity, and the constant changing of usernames shows that plainly. If they were sincere and honest, they wouldn't need to do this. There is no need for being 'covert' and evasive when your motives are sincere. These are the same guys who have colluded in the past to delete important posts regarding 9/11 and other topics which were actually having an impact, and which are incredibly vital to the fight for liberty in which we are now involved.

So to address some of the points in your post:
I (and most other DPers ) have no problem with liberty and personal choice..... People can vote for Bob Barr, Baldwin, Santa Clause, or Satan for that matter, if they want to. What we DO have a problem with is the CONTINUOUS spamming here for a candidate (Barr) who voted for the Patriot Act, and in whom perceptive Revolutionaries have little to no trust. This site is a Ron Paul site. These guys don't respect others on this site and are constantly trying to marginalize solid positions which are presented here on crucial issues.
"I'm convinced that most people on this forum are complete idiots. There are a few intelligent people, but most are idiots or crazy." preferred

I agree that many other DPers support Barr and have a different postion than the rest of us who don't trust him. That is their right and healthy discussion and debate is a good thing. I am merely trying to expose the one or two 'members' here who are strictly working to undermine the momentum of the Ron Paul Revolution..... the ones who evade direct questions, use circular arguements, change user names every couple of days, and who 'talk to themselves' via different user names in an attempt to fool and manipulate others into believing that they have support for an indefensible position.

I also tend to disagree with you that being agressive in the search for and presentation of truth in ANY form is harmful to the movement. I understand that certain topics are contriversial (9/11 in particular), but it is those very topics which hold the key to defeating the entire neocon powerbase. If we hold back the truth in order to 'spare someone's feelings' etc, then we are just as guilty of manipulation as the neocons, MSM, etc. The revolution is based on truth, personal responsibility, and the fact that A is A.... that reality is reality and must be dealt with accordingly. When we omit important truths and edit content to make the message more 'appealing' then we compromise the very integrity which give the Revolution it's power. The thing about the truth is that no matter how ugly it is, it can't be changed, and therefore can be depended on to be a constant... an absolute.
The fact that these clowns are here all day, every day, doing nothing but attempting to detract from the truth of 9/11, the dubious nature of Bob Barr etc, shows that we have them scared. What's more, it shows that either they don't have a job, or more likely that spreading disinfo IS their job. I, for one, am not going to sit back and be 'nice' and 'tolerant' of people whose sole motivation and purpose here is to undermine the very priciples of liberty that I would give my life to defend.

So, say what you will, I refuse to sit back and be passive when it comes to those who obviously want the Revolution, 9/11 truth, and Liberty to fail. I will be as mean, aggressive, and juvinile as it takes to expose these disinfo ass clowns for what they are.

"Doc" Holladay
Nashville, TN
http://www.myspace.com/do...

Then why should we consider Barr when Ron Paul will not even endorse him.
So no way Bob Barr. You voted for the patriot act and you are still pro war and something smells...

I see Barr supporters simply posting his major media appearances. Most Barr interviews mention Dr. Paul. Why not hear them. I rarely see Barr supporters attacking Baldwin for no reason. They are coming across the the much more civil ones.

You have the basic point right. The angry anti Barr ones are the people who were out front in the beginning of Pauls run giving us a bad name.

I will gladly accept a cease fire... if the bob barr trolls would quit spamming thier propaganda. I think that action alone would end MOST of the conflict on this site. Now i'm even getting private emails from these trolls trying to intimidate me... Puh-lease. Just get back to talking about freedom and not endorsing your candidate (Bob CIA Borring - who is severly lacking) and most people will be on your side.

Aku Soku Zan

"With all that said, if the radical "Ron Paul or nothing" wackos want to attack me as a plant, have at it."

Yawn... trolls that want sympathy. /singletear.

Aku Soku Zan

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www.dvds4delegates.com

to awake folks everywhere I would say Ron Paul/Jesse Ventura 2008............

but..........

it can still happen.

I don't think it matters.

I wasn't aware that this debate over Barr and Baldwin was really that big of a deal.... just that it was annoying and a waste of space.

Neither of them will win, so it's not like we're facing a problem of who do we throw our support and energy behind? It wouldn't matter anyways. And both represent the message fairly well, so we're not losing anything by voting for them.

Why would you ever want to vote for anyone who voted YES to negate the protections of your rights that the US Constitution was written to ensure? Why would you want to vote for someone who violated their oath of office and failed to defend the US Constitution from all enemies, foreign and especially domestic?

It's this simple...if you stop voting people into office who violate their oath EVEN ONCE the problem will be solved. As long as you're dumb enough to believe the BS excuses that politicians give and vote those who violate their oath of office back into office again & again, the problems will continue get worse.

I would add that statistically speaking, no single vote matters anyway in terms of who is elected. They talk about every vote counting, but that isn't the truth. No election of this size could statistically be decided by a single vote. It is so mathematically unlikely as to be a virtual impossibility.

Therefore, your vote, my vote, everyone's vote has only one purpose... To allow us to look at ourselves in the mirror. Voting is extremely important (and choosing NOT to vote is a vote as well), but not because you may win or lose. Collectivists use a win/lose voting mentality to herd people. But we are individualists, or we wouldn't be here, and therefore, I hope that all understand what I am saying.

Who you vote for matters to no one but yourself, does not effect the grand scheme of things, in fact, CAN NOT effect change.

All that it effects is whether you are happy with your choice. And if someday, our society has the same values that we all share, then maybe that will be reflected in those who we elect to office.

There is a saying (not sure where it came from) about a man who tried to change the world, and failed, so he tried to change his town and failed, so he tried to change his family, and failed. Giving up, he decided all that he could do was change himself, which in turn changed his family, which changed the town, which changed the world, and so in the end succeeded.

If you really live and believe the ideals, and teach those who ask. We will have our impact on the world and this election matters little.

freedumb is not free! im not a conspiracy theorist or a truther i see you lumped them together with racists abit harsh . seems like you are talking about acceptance and then contridict yourself at the end. i guess you are all for unity of acceptable groups. please provide a list for me so i know he to attack.

Ron Paul is the grand daddy of this good 'ol revolution, no doubt. But I really don't care who is doing the spreading of this message, whether he's called Bob Barr or Billy Baldwin.

I will support anyone with the courage to talk about liberty in the mainstream media!

I think if Ron Paul's campaign for president taught us anything, it's this:
we need to be more aggressive! Spread the message and bring uncomfortable topics up! Be that person who breaks the ice!

This is do or die!

This is a necessary post. Well said. Basically, anyone who was drawn to Ron Paul should understand that ....FREEDOM is popular! hhaha

I think most understand that the only way to make change is if we all vote for who we really believe in. That's all we should be doing as voters. Not like the 100 million sheep who vote for who they wantto/think can win.

If you were in the revolution and are more liberal leaning, vote for Nader.
If you are a conservative, vote Barr or Baldwin. If you are contemplating voting McCain or Obama, you weren't paying attention.

"There's somethin' happenin' here..."

"Tyranny is always better organised than freedom." -Charles Péguy

Why is this so? Because the tyrant would have us be mindless sheep, not thinking for ourselves, but accepting whatever his lackeys regurgitate for us. So, their followers, thought weak-minded, are like-minded.

Freedom, or liberty, on the other hand, has us thinking for ourselves, acting for ourselves, following our own interests, pursuing what we ourselves, define as happiness. It is clear that we often reach different conclusions by the myriad opinions expressed here. While this is the benefit of liberty, it is also its downfall. It is very difficult to get (lowercase l) libertarians to unite. Kudos to Ron Paul for doing it so effectively.

We need to get past our petty differences and remember that we are all at liberty to have petty differences. This movement should never take on the objective of turning us all into drones (see tyranny above).

There are far better means of persuasion than telling someone they are a moron for voting for a certain candidate. Try telling about the virtues of the one you support.

None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe that they are free. -Goethe

one of the best posts I have ever read on DP.
only one thing I disagree with.
quote;
"Much like the aggressive conspiracy theorists, truthers, racists, etc., they're people who give us a bad image and are hurting us."

so here you seem to want to divide us all.
why you put 9/11 folks like myself with racists?
perhaps it is just a mistake on your part because of the emotional level while writing...

Ron Paul has called for a new investigation into the events of 9/11 many times...

and so called conspiracy people are human beings who want change as much as you do.Respect them for their work toward awareness.