Your YouTube Viewing Habits Handed Over by Court Order
Posted July 3rd, 2008 by fanofwalt
output
The ever-excellent and on-top-of-it Electronic Frontier Foundation (EFF) is reporting some frightening news:
Court Ruling Will Expose Viewing Habits of YouTube Users (article dated July 2, 2008)
Excerpt:
Yesterday, in the Viacom v. Google litigation, the federal court for the Southern District of New York ordered Google to produce to Viacom (over Google's objections):
all data from the Logging database concerning each time a YouTube video has been viewed on the YouTube website or through embedding on a third-party website
The court’s order grants Viacom's request and erroneously ignores the protections of the federal Video Privacy Protection Act (VPPA), and threatens to expose deeply private information about what videos are watched by YouTube users.
(...)
The Logging database contains:
for each instance a video is watched, the unique “login ID” of the user who watched it, the time when the user started to watch the video, the internet protocol address other devices connected to the internet use to identify the user’s computer (“IP address”), and the identifier for the video.
Google correctly argued that “the data should not be disclosed because of the users’ privacy concerns,” citing the VPPA, 18 U.S.C. § 2710. However, the Court dismissed this argument with no analysis, stating “defendants cite no authority barring them from disclosing such information in civil discovery proceedings, and their privacy concerns are speculative.”
(...)
In any event, the court ordered production of not just IP addresses, but also all the associated information in the Logging database. Whatever might be said about 'an IP address without additional information,' the the AOL search history leak fiasco shows that the material viewed by a user alone can be sufficient to identify the user, even with neither a login nor an IP address.
Read the whole article for more details. Interesting: it doesn't seem that Viacom is demanding info on people watching videos with Viacom content per se, but rather Viacom is demanding info on all video watching activity by all YouTube users.
And the court granted their request.
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Wow. Oh Noooooo.
I hope they like Ron Paul, Christopher Titus, Jeff Dunham and the one and only video I ever made out of the game I play on occasion.
http://www.youtube.com/wa...
Now Viacom finds out what Big Brother Really Has.
Big Brother google gets their skirt lifted a bit.
http://www.google-watch.o...
all those girls shaking their booty are supposed to be over 18
plus i never contacted any of them and asked if i we could meet in a park or at the Dateline NBC studio
like an old bigwig judge is
like an old bigwig judge is going to know squat about the technical concerns of modern technology especially when relating to computers. This is a joke. if a judge is to make such a ruling, we should instate a law that he/she must first program the clock on their old, broke ass VCR first. then we can consider them at least capable of making any kind of ruling over technical disputes.
privacy concerns are SPECULATIVE??
how does one speculate logging your ip address and viewing behaviors and handing it over to a 3rd party as maybe possibly a privacy concern?
idiots.
Yes, blame the judge
spin-meister 101.
If that is the case
I am a homegrown terrorist for sure!
http://www.youtube.com/wa...
We need to boycott Viacom
We need to boycott Viacom and the other 5 big media companies. Trade or sell any DVD/CDs you have from them and get food or music and movies from the smaller companies like Weinstein, Lionsgate, Thinkfilm, IFC, Merge, Matador, etc.
Google is the problem NOT Viacom
The youtube/google business scam is over the top.
Viacom creates content for a living, google enables the wholesale theft of this content as a matter of practice.
Google has no respect for Your Privacy or Property Rights, they are dirty and Viacom is only acting in the interest of protecting property they own.
Um, not necescelery
Let's see some of the things Viacom was after, shall we?
The following items are drawn from this article.
- Viacom was seeking a critical trade secret: the computer source code which controls both the YouTube.com search function and Google’s internet search tool of Google.com. Viacom also wanted Google to produce another trade secret, the source code for its video ID program.. The judge agreed that the search code “is of enormous commercial value” and could cause harm to Google even with a confidentiality agreement. The judge denied Viacom’s request.
Is Google's / YouTube source code and video ID program property owned by Viacom?
- Viacom wanted Google to turn over all removed videos from YouTube. Google said Viacom should have to specify the videos it wants. The judge sided with Viacom. Google has to hand over all of the removed videos, a total in the millions.
Are you asserting that Viacom owns EVERY SINGLE VIDEO ever placed and removed on YouTube?
Viacom wanted video related data from YouTube’s logging database. That’s a toned down way to say that Viacom wanted login IDs, the time a user watched it, the IP address and the video identifier. The judge ruled for Viacom and Google has to produce the user histories.
Login IDs, IP addresses, video identifiers and each time a user watched ANY video are all the property of Viacom?
Viacom wanted data on all private videos from YouTube users. A private video is one where only a person authorized by a user can view it.
Google argued that Viacom’s request is a privacy violation under the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. Viacom argued that it needed to view these private videos to gauge copyright violations. The judge ruled for Google.
Viacom could have sorted through millions of private videos–say a childbirth or 2 year old birthday party video for family–in a quest for some Rugrats copyright violation. Google could have handed over most of its advertising IP to Viacom, which would have likely benefited because it depends on advertising too.
There's more at the link I provided in this comment. Go see for yourself. Viacom was not singling in on Viacom content; they wanted every freaking thing, and thanks to the judge, they got most of what they requested. I don't know that either party is "innocent," but if we're measuring levels of evil, I rather think that Viacom (and the judge) comes out stinking the worst here.
Google is Evil - Wholesale theft of Intellectual Property
Viacom is simply protecting its Property rights.
Google is not a search engine. They are an arm of big brother, the CEO is a bilderberger aiming to cash in on globalism.
The whole corporate agenda of google is appalling.
Next to the military, Google
Next to the military, Google is the biggest donator to the campaign for Ron Paul's Presidency. Did you even read the guys post? You seem to be taking it as a religion that Google is evil (they are evil even though I've been proven wrong! It doesn't matter I will still believe in it). You sound like a brainwashed fool to me!
BTW, the oh-so-great company of Viacom is indeed in the business of theft too!
\"Viacom hits me with copyright infringement for posting on YouTube a video that Viacom made by infringing on my own copyright! "
http://theknightshift.blo...
umm... is there anything to
umm... is there anything to this that you could support as evidence or are you just corporation bashing? did you used to work there or know something about them that would back that up?
looking at it from a consumers perspective, google has one of the most noble (and decidedly profitable) corporate goals out there. To be a powerhouse of free, open source knowledge of all kinds. Anything from information to the internet, to maps and directions, to market quotes, interactive document sharing... hell they even provide their home town with free public wi-fi with unlimited access and never have to ask the end user for money in exchange for their services. I think that it is a forward thinking business model that will see itself really catch on widespread in the future.
youtube is a technology meant to allow users to share videos with each other and comment on them, allowing people who dont know each other to glimpse videos of the interests of other people. its an amazing concept and youtube's variation of the tech was inevitably the most popular and it was seen as an essential asset for google to purchase.
So youd rather blame google/youtube for bringing an extremely useful social networking tool to market for people to freely use instead of blaming individuals who would seek to exploit that service to in turn break copyright laws? This to me is just another evasion of personal responsibility which has overwhelmed and plagued this nation since the 40's. blame never seems to fall where it lies. Sure Viacom might have a strong obligation to its own interests to protect their copyright material, but suing the pants off of google is like torching the horse for being whipped to carry the wagon to the wrong destination.
yummy yummy google
I couldn't have said it better myself.
Do you write jingles too?
Let's say Google is big, bad, mean, and has bad breath
Did you happen to read my comment just above yours?
Regardless of how you feel about Google, do you actually believe Viacom is "simply" protecting its property rights? So then...those questions I posed in that comment above; you believe Viacom does, in fact, own all those things?
Or is wholesale dragnetting a-ok when you're only after a sliver of the population? Everyone guilty until proven innocent?
And if you do think that's okay...um, you do realize you're at the Daily Paul here, right?
Apparently he can't answer a simple question...
This particular thread is resembling what Kevin Barrett has described as a "Turing test." You may be "communicating with a CIA computer-generated linguistic simulacrum" designed to drive you crazy.
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"We really do have...a once in a lifetime opportunity to take the Republican Party back to where it was." -Kent Snyder, 1959-2008
yes, there is definitely something wrong with "JohnKing"
fanofwalt is displaying admirable patience and diligence, but it's become obvious that "JohnKing" has an agenda of some kind.
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The googleplex spin-meisters are everywhere
Seriously, who in their right mind would defend any corporation that holds the power of google?
Oh.. hmmmmm
No one.
Well, maybe the mind-share folks from google or delirious fan boys.
Please return to your NSA inspired cubicle.
You didnt even say anything
You didnt even say anything to prove your point whatsoever. BESIDES THE MILITARY GOOGLE IS THE TOP DONATOR TO RON PAUL!! Fucking retard. Just because Google is a corporation doesnt make it evil! GOOGLE DOESNT PUT ILLEGAL VIDEOS ON THERE, INDIVIDUALS DO!! OR ARE YOU TOO FUCKING STUPID TO COMPREHEND THAT ONE?
google is top donator to Hillary too! More $$$$$$$$$
Watch Eric Schmidt FAWN over Hillary.
Its a mutual globalist love affair.
WATCH ON YOUTUBE :)
http://www.youtube.com/wa...
I want google to have all my health care records!!!
YEE haw!
Thank you for your kind words.
For years, I worked with attorneys, producers, CEOs and other prima donnas in the entertainment industry.
I now homeschool two young children who are with me All. Day. Long. Every. Single. Day.
Go ahead. Try to break me.
Google is the Root issue
I know how you "feel" about google. Those feelings have been very carefully crafted by a very clever group of people who have convinced you google is cool, cutting edge, all knowing and trustworthy.
Again, google is under the gun for stepping on property rights.
Are you suggesting google is a trustworthy repository of all this user data that they hold?
The root goes deeper
: scans OP and comments :
Hm, the only thing I could find that I wrote that might give any insight as to my perception of Google is this:
I don't know that either party is "innocent," but if we're measuring levels of evil, I rather think that Viacom (and the judge) comes out stinking the worst here.
Doesn't really sound like a shining vouch of Google's character, but, since you already know how I feel about Google, I guess the question is moot, eh? ;)
The actual root issue is the entire topic of copyright, DRM, DMCA, the whole RIAA and MPAA mess and our legislators who bend over backwards to work on behalf of these private industries.
Did you know that great portions of legislative history has now been copyrighted and cannot be freely obtained? This is public record I'm talking about here. See here, and here, and also here. This is where all this copyright and intellectual property madness has brought us.
Disclosure: I used to work in the Anti-Piracy Department of the Legal Division of a Very Major Entertainment Company (which one, you can probably guess, unless you're guessing "Viacom").
Not defending Google
but at least they put up a defense to try to keep the non-Viacom-related user info out of the mix.
Viacom sued to get everybody's info(besideds just Viacom copyrighted stuff), which I would estimate could consist of the vast majority of the info they got. The Viacom-related stuff would be a miniscule fraction of the total YouTube database.
Viacom sued for alot more information than anyone could be entitled to, and that puts the onus squarely on them.
Don't Ignore the Obvious
What is google doing storing this information anyway? Big Brother in googly-goo cutey suit.
The deflection of liability is astounding. The google spin-meisters are everywhere.
Your privacy is compromised if you use youtube/google services because they have abhorrent privacy policies.
But of course lets blame Viacom.
Doh!
You are severely retarded.
You are severely retarded. Look at the facts instead of pulling them out of your ass. You're saying Viacom isn't accountable for trying to obtain this information? You're saying Viacom is entitled to this information, REGARDLESS of your person opinions of Google? You probably work for Viacom. BTW, Google doesnt upload videos, individuals do.
This is like everything else, folks
The government and their bureaucrats will continue to do this until people and corporations very simply REFUSE TO COMPLY. Think about what would happen if 5 or 10 million of us decided tomorrow to simply STOP PAYING TAXES. What would they do? They don't have enough guns to threaten that many of us. So keep crying about lawsuits if you want, they won't do any good. The courts have been politicized. The only solution is to REFUSE TO COMPLY. If a law is unconstitutional, REFUSE TO COMPLY. If you are imprisoned over it, do not back down and give the enslavers what they want. REFUSE TO COMPLY. This is the only way left to us to fight unjust and immoral laws. All other avenues have been corrupted.
'Live for yourself, there's no one else more worth living for,
Begging hands and bleeding hearts
Will only cry out for more...'
What possible grounds
could Viacom have to demand all these data logs about users and information which have absolutely nothing to do with them or their business? And on what grounds could any judge grant such a demand?
Methinks that Viacom is a front organization being used to sue and get court rulings for allowing all kinds of data-mining and infringements about users of media, and probably turning that info directly over to gov't intelligence agencies.
Notice that for some unknown reason, it's always Viacom that's involved in all these things. Not Universal, or MGM or whatever, just Viacom.
Perhaps it should be called "CIA-com".
Maybe a little research into who's running Viacom, and their connections, might be a fun little research task.
I'll give you a brief
I'll give you a brief rundown of Viacom.
Sumner Redstone bought Viacom in the early 80's through a chain of drive in and multiplex movie theaters in the north east (based out of MA), which he inherited from his father. Prior to taking over his father's company, he was a successful lawyer, even arguing cases before the Supreme Court. Upon taking over the company, Redstone went through a string of litigations, which he won, over a number of years against major player in his industry, showing a real litigious streak. To this day, Redstone owns the largest block of shares in Viacom through a holding company called Northeast Theater Corp.
The reason Viacom is pursuing litigation like this is twofold. First, Redstone has a history and talent in court unlike anyone else in the industry. Second, since the purchase of Paramount Studios, Viacom has been working under the business model of acquiring the "software" of entertainment. That's to say they have been acquiring collections of content and content production houses. The idea being that the distribution of media is rapidly changing but the content will be delivered one way or another. Allowing YouTube or someone else to distribute the content for free is a direct threat to this business model (or at least that's what they think, I would partly disagree).
Based on Viacom's perspective, what they did in this suit was correct. Asking for the whole list of users' histories, and the YouTube code, was a bargaining ploy. When you go into negotiations you ask for more than you want so you can compromise. The judge is to blame for giving all of the user data away, not Viacom.
To change the judges ruling, which was incorrect, we need to pressure Google to appeal the decision, perhaps with the help of the EFF. That is the only way we are going to change this.
One last point for the "conspiracy theorists". Redstone was an OSS officer back in WWII, and the content produced by Viacom is just as suspect as the rest of the industry, so saying that this is a way to get all the data for a third party isn't crazy but given the history of him and the company I don't think its likely.
You're muddling the issue
And you're too naive.
For starters, there's this
Wikipedia entry for Viacom.
More links on the YouTube story
YouTube vs. Viacom: Google's IP Wins; Users Lose
Spells out in chilling clarity what Viacom asked for and what it got.
YouTube Ordered to Give Complete User Logs to Viacom
Judge Protects YouTube's Source Code; Throws Users to the Wolves
Excerpt:
The privacy fallout of this ruling is spectacular. The EFF has already chimed in, noting that the order is highly likely to be in violation of federal law.
Judge Stanton doesn’t seem to care much about that law, for now. And he clearly doesn’t understand that far more data is being transferred than is necessary to comply with Viacom’s core stated concern, which is to understand the popularity of copyright infringing v. non-infringing material. Viacom has asked for far more data than that, and there’s only one use for that data: to sue individual users (or shake them down via the threat of lawsuit, which has been perfected by the RIAA) who have watched a few music videos or television shows on YouTube.
I say this with the utmost respect, but Judge Stanton is a moron. And Google simply cannot hand this data over without facing a class action lawsuit of staggering proportions.
And for a little backstory, here's Google: Viacom’s YouTube lawsuit threatens DMCA; The full response, from May 26, 2008.
Lawsuit or No
The government now has all the information they need...
Google shouldn't be storing these records
Its just another google scam.
If you don't want your habits analyzed, recorded, etc.
Don't use google.
Could you please tell me what search engine
would be good to use instead of google? Thank you
I suggest you vary things a bit
http://www.ask.com
http://search.msn.com
http://search.yahoo.com
http://www.gigablast.com
Scroogle.ORG
Yeah it's a real website, www.scroogle.ORG
Thank you
Been checking out some, but it takes time to find a new one, and needed input.
Not Good
Good job for postin' this waltfan.
Good job with dictionary encouragement, hence "coprolalia".
Guess I'm a bit confused, what does Google have to do with YouTube? Google buy YouTube? Duh..beats me.
Uh....about the 3 years ago.
Uh....about the 3 years ago. <_<
They bought youTube for over a $1 billion dollars. I wish I created YouTube.
Thanks
Be interesting to own such a thing huh.
What the
What the fuck........Bullshit
There's a special word for that
No, it's not supercalifragilisticexpialidocious; when you suddenly lose the ability to express yourself by any means other than that demonstrated above, you are experiencing coprolalia.
The FLDS stories induced vehement coprolalia in me.
Unfortunately, there is a plethora of coprolalia-inducing stories these days. This is but one of them.
Isn't coprolalia
Isn't coprolalia uncontrolled like Turrets? <_<
This is crazy !
I'll read the article, but I would think the courts would only allow VIACOM branded/trademarked video logs to be searched, not the whole Google library. Google should fight this to the end if they want to keep users. If they don't, then I will never use Google services anymore, Gmail, Youtube, Google Video, none of their products. Guess it's time to start downloading and archiving folks. The sad thing is, the big corporates can afford the huge bandwidth costs running video services, I just don't know exactly how much though. I do get letters often from west coast providers for highspeed lines at the paultry minimal tune of $20,000 a month. Naw, can't afford that lol
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Ron Paul's Campaign for Liberty Money Bomb!
"We really do have...a once in a lifetime opportunity to take the Republican Party back to where it was." -Kent Snyder, 1959-2008
Well Viacom wants to know if they should produce another...
"Bridezilla" or some other stupid show. Viacom, I would suspect has advertising dollars in mind, not if you watched some kid falling off his skateboard.
The problem lies not with Viacom, BUT with that Judge. THAT guy needs to be impeached, recalled, or at the least NOT voted in next time
In Christ,
Dave
www.lionandlambministry.c...
www.lionandlambtv.com
The government operates via the corporations
To conceal blame. Surely you know that? No? Read: The Confessions of an Economic Hitman for proof. Or watch this: http://www.youtube.com/wa.... The rabbit hole is much deeper than you think......
Watch this?
Of course, if you watch that, it'll be added to your information list for Viacom to review...
I wonder whether YouTube viewers should get together and file a lawsuit to compel all employees and officers of Viacom to reveal their habits (what kind of habits is up to the imagination of the plaintiffs)?
Hey, you know what might be fun? Everybody makes videos with titles like, "Viacom Sucks" or "Look at This Great Viacom Program!" or other such baited headlines...that all go to the infamous RickRoll vid. Remember to put a Viacom logo or image in for one second at the halfway point to get that all-important "representative" thumbnail posted! Hee!!
LOL !
Good one fanofwalt, that made me laugh. I can't believe that judge allowed Viacom to do this. It's completely and totally wrong. I am hoping a strong appeal is made and this gets thrown out. Like others say here, it's either they are looking for marketing dollars, or copyright infringments on their material, or the judge is a front for big brother and got a nice sum paid under the table.
-
Show your support on the Ron Paul Map !
People worldwide support Dr. Paul too :-)
http://www.pollingmatrix....
"RICKROLL".......I love it! GReat idea
In Christ,
Dave
www.lionandlambministry.c...
www.lionandlambtv.com