9/11 thread to end all 9/11 threads - UNDEBUNKABLE
Everyone keeps making these 9/11 threads where they present their own little half baked theories and try to "prove" whether or not 9/11 was an inside job. I think discussion of 9/11 is very important and extremely relevant to everything we are fighting for here in the liberty movement. That is why I am making this thread.
However, I will not present another set of platitudes and shoddy explanations. I am not a professional with a doctorate, and as such I think it is important to inject a little real science from people who are. Here I am going to post unbiased scientific papers which show with apodictic certainty that controlled demolition MUST have occurred.
To me, at least, it seems there is a serious lack of scientific understanding on daily paul, and it can get frustrating. If you do not understand what science is, or how evidence and reason work, please go back to one of the other 9/11 rumor threads. Anyone who does understand science, please read these papers openly and honestly, and I guarentee you will see that controlled demolition is obvious and certain.
Here are some papers:
http://www.journalof911st...
http://www.journalof911st...
http://www.journalof911st...
http://www.journalof911st...
http://www.journalof911st...
And here is the site which publishes the papers:
9/11 is the most important thing we can discuss, in my humble opinion. Why is that? Because 9/11 is that absolute backbone of everything that has been happening. Every neocon has rested their political career on it, every police state measure and war measure rests upon it, the entire credibility of the MSM depends upon 9/11 truth not coming out. If we can break 9/11, then we bring down the entire establishment in one fell swoop. It is the Achilles tendon of the criminals in government and the media, and it is vitally important to expose 9/11 and set everything straight once and for all....
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Wake Up!!!
George Bush Sr. = the former head of CIA, GAVE weapons to Saddam Hussein, (pics of this on internet), countless other crimes...
G.W. Bush JR. = acting president During 911 attack, Liar, War Criminal, theif, etc.
&
Marvin P. Bush (THE BROTHER of G.W. you don't know about) = In CHARGE OF SECURITY on the 911 SITE! He was a principal player in a company called Securacom/Stratesec that provided security for the World Trade Center, United Airlines, and Dulles International Airport. Those of you who don't think this was a Neo-Con Bush-whacker job are delusional.
That is just WAY TOO MANY Bushs' in my book! (Let's not forget the Jeb Bush creating diversions in FLA).
http://www.whatreallyhapp...
http://www.youtube.com/wa...
The 9/11 Operation: A Summary
The 9/11 operation consisted of the following activities:
Military exercises by the North American Aerospace Defense Command (NORAD) with 22 imaginarily hijacked planes on 9/11/2001, before and simultaneously with the “real” hijackings. Some of the defense interceptors flew to Alaska, as far as possible from the cities that were being attacked. All FAA Flight Termination Systems (FTS) were deactivated so that no “false groundings” of commercial planes would occur.
The operation involved the “hijackings” of four civilian aircraft, then substituting them with remote-controlled USAF aircraft or “drones”. It is certain that an operation this complex and sophisticated (even in the preparations of the demolition charges at the WTC) is not left to be handled by Arab lackeys armed only with carpeting knives. Plissken-Valentine, FTS by SPC or Pearl are well-documented available technologies on how the aircraft/attack portion of the operation was performed. Since the part of airplanes hijacked and flown into buildings was critical to the real aims of the operation there must have been a couple of reserve planes for the USAF - Boeing 767's and the Global Hawk. Alternatively, the Boeing 757 shot down in Pennsylvania might well have been a remote- controlled reserve plane utilized because of the NORAD exercises.
More... http://www.arsenalofhypoc...
"PunJab! Bring me my checkbook!"
9-11
video you tube then type in aaron russo nick rockefeller
you tube then type in BURIED 60 Minutes INTERVIEW / INDICTMENT
Liberty is our campaigns gift to the world it is our manifest destiny.
Freedom is a movement who's time has come. Our campaign will lead to world wide freedom.
I think EVERYONE can agree- 'SOMETHING' is 'UP' -bottom line.
Whether there is 'proof' for certain actions, explosions, and stories is debatable.
I think MOST people would agree, that while we might not know EXACTLY what happened and DIDN'T HAPPEN- we can ALL agree that SOMETHING DOES 'NOT' seem right about the whole 9/11.
Either our government was involved in the very DESTRUCTION of the buildings, OR the government SIMPLY KNEW ABOUT the attacks before hand but did NOTHING to create another 'Pearl Harbor' situation.
I think we ALL can agree- the government is being LESS THAN TRUTHFUL ABOUT ''''''MUCH'''''' OF THE DETAILS.
I disagree ....
Most likely the government did not know. They should have and that is where the investigation should concentrate.
Also, almost definitely, the government did not have an active role in 9/11.
Notice, I said "Almost definitely". This implies speculation.
I do agree that the government is most likely being less than forthcoming with the evidence that they possess.
WAHOR!!
dammit all to hell, rhinoplasy!
you speak in circles trying so damn hard to not give in to the TRUTH!!
you are so damn gullible!! so unassuming....please send me 5000 dollars in a plain, unmarked envelope and i will make you rich!
O Captain, My Captain, rise up and hear the bells!
I would do just that ...
If I believed you.
Be prepared, because it is hard to convince me of anything without evidence.
WAHOR!!
so silly
why would the government have the evidence of a crime scene removed illegally as soon as possible man ? think about it ?
All the steel that was cut had to be taken away before it was scrutinized but pieces were recovered and fouind to have thermate residue . So they messed up and the case will be pending with that evidence.
I have seen all the evidence available and I have studied all ..
the theories.
If someone thinks I haven't then I challenge them to show me.
By the way, illegally removing evidence is a crime, do you have names, because I did not see Rudy remove one piece of evidence.
The thermite residue theory has been debunked.
I actually hope you are right, because it makes our job a lot easier, but hope will get you a wet willy and an audience in front of a theater full of humans that do not exist.
WAHOR!!
that is where they lost me.
yes, they hauled away the debris and it was destroyed.
is it illegal at this point??? depends on who's doing the 'defining'.
you are a liar!
you are an imbecile, an idiot and you are part of the problem
you haven't studied all of the evidence you callous jerk!
because if you had, in effect, studied ALL of the evidence you would not reach this insane conclusion you try to put forward
just go away troll...
save your lies for sunday school
i am done wasting my time with you, you moron, you plant, you insignificant LIAR!!
from now on, when you hear me say troll, you can read between the lines
O Captain, My Captain, rise up and hear the bells!
I am not a liar ...
and I request that you back that accusation up with some evidence.
Remember, Mr. Cage clearly states when he is speculating.
Barry Jennings is a proven liar.
Alex Jones releases edited footage.
If you wish I can prove all these in a few minutes.
WAHOR!!!
very funny...
you want me to show "more" evidence while you show zero, zilch, nada, nothing, except--- "nope, didn't happen"...typical
O Captain, My Captain, rise up and hear the bells!
To each thier own...
Why get into a debate with someone who does not show that they can follow something to a logical conclusion?
If you want to do that, just go to a local insane asylum and argue with a patient about why red is blue... it all ends up the same at the end of the debate. Just a waste of time on your part.
Rhino has his beliefs. I have mine. You have yours. At this point in the game, it seems he is sticking by his guns.
So no amount of logic is going to fix that for him. It is just what he believes.
That we find his thoughts faulty is a given: that he thinks he is right is his right. Or wrong....lol.
So no sense answering him anymore.. he already has shown that he will not be swayed by things like math, gravity, logic, reality, physics, etc.
Nobody learns anything from this kind of debate.
thank you!
...ty
O Captain, My Captain, rise up and hear the bells!
Devon
I am disappointed.
This has nothing to do with my beliefs. As I have stated, I have no preconceived conclusions about 9/11.
I will let the logic statement speak for itself.
WAHOR!!
Why don't you take that a bit further...
and just speak for yourself then?
It seems, from what you have been saying, that you have certain thoughts about 9/11.
I'm open to any views on the subject.. what do you think?
Last time I checked, Mike still doesn't really allow free speech here.. so if you want to discuss your views on another forum, you are a member of mine.
If you wish to discuss it here, I'll start a thread for you.
Are you willing to tell me what you think happened?
After all, it is just logic, as you say... let's see where this goes then!
It is very simple ...
and it has everything to do with the truth and not what I believe, because they are identicle.
The truth is we do not know the complete truth.
And I will add, we probably never will.
But I sure would love complete transparency and the release of all evidence so that independant groups can do their own investigation and publish their own conclusions.
Do not worry, I will visit from time to time.
WAHOR!!
You are not willing to tell me then?
I asked a very simple question, after all. If you are an admitted expert to what happened at 9/11 or not.. can you at least share with me what you think happened?
It requires a simple answer.. yes, or no.
If you can, then I'll start a thread here for you.. if that makes you uncomfortable, I will start a thread at LibertyLove.
If you cannot, then the last 4 months of you debunking everything as you go makes no sense at all... because that means you have no clue.
SoOo.. what's it gonna be?
HINT... this is a yes or no answer.
Waiting on Rhino again....
~Whistling the theme song to Jeopardy~
why bother ?
he's a moron ? I'm a structural engineer I build everyday .
Just to let you know ...
I know you are lying about being a structural engineer.
You also claim to be a musician, be involved in cults, have a friend that disappeared in Oregon who was fighting against chemtrails, a daughter in San Diego, and so on and so on.
Get lost, you are a proven liar.
WAHOR!!
Are you a builder or an engineer?
I am in the same field, not an engineer, but similar.
WAHOR!!
I didn't think so.
Case closed.. never mind.
seriously
If I accepted something as rediculous as the Official story of the collapses I would be laughed out of my company and people would think I'm insane. Everyone in my business knows it's a joke but they won't tell you that on the "news"
Do you work for this company or do you own it?
Just curious.
WAHOR!!
Sentinel ...
you say you are a structural engineer.
What type of work do you do?
WAHOR!!
I have been building houses for 25 years now
two community hospitals a skating center and when I started I built a bunch of detroit river front bars , four in total. the hospitals were only designed by me.
Are you a builder with
a structural engineering degree or do you just collaborate with an archetecht on the design of the structures?
WAHOR!!
I will assume that you had to step away.
I must do the same.
Good night.
WAHOR!!
Still waiting for Rhino...
To make a reply to this post.
~foot tappin~
Devon ...
Sorry about that. Family duties.
Are you still there?
WAHOR!!
For now, more important is HOW 9/11 HAS BEEN USED
The events of 9/11 have been used to impose a police state in America and to justify aggressive war abroad.
That is true whether 9/11 was an inside job or not.
It is certainly true that the government's Official Conspiracy Theory is wrong; there are too many facts at odds with the gov't version of events. Getting to the bottom of the 9/11 crimes is important, but in the meantime we should remember that no matter WHO caused the attacks, a rogue group within our own government -- the neocons -- have used 9/11 to stage a coup that has included stripping Americans of their rights. For more on the topic, see:
Top Ten Reasons for a New 9/11 Investigation
http://www.strike-the-roo...
oooohhh...
a coup ... before our very own eyes. crap. that thought sucks.
Yeah, that thought sucks. Too bad it's true.
FISA, Patriot Act, Military Tribunals Act, the $385 million Haliburton contract for a string of detention (i.e., concentration) camps, spying on Americans' phone calls, internet usage, banking transactions, etc. etc.
If you think THIS is what the Founders created or wanted, or if any of the above is in harmony with the highest law of the land (which no mere act of congress, presidential signing statement, or court ruling can nulify or overrule), then I guess you're right: things are hunky-dory and my "coup" comment was just inflammatory overstatment.
Everyone else can think for themselves and decide on their own if the regime now in power is acting in accordance with their oath of office, or not.
This whole inside job movement ...
has awakened me.
I had always assumed that others thought as I did.
That truth is not relative and it must be certain.
I now know why I am not understood in a lot of circumstances.
People have preconceived relative truths that they hold solid to, even in the face of evidence that poses a counter theory.
I thank you all.
The truth is we do not know the truth.
WAHOR!!
You
You don't want to know the truth!
You sound like an atheist.
You have no faith.
Therefore, "you" go in circles.
That'll be $50 bucks.
Watching the PBS...
documentary years ago made me wonder about the center, undamaged, core columns and why they collapsed in a pancake-type failure. The computer animation even showed the core intact as the floors joists gave way and fell. I'm sure they had a logical explanation of this phenomenom. The NIST called it, "unique". Yeah, that was it.
AnnieGun, this ONE INCIDENT
is the premise for all the growing government you see around us.
It is the premise for two preemptive wars. It is the premise for the Patriot Act, Military Commissions Act, Homegrown Terrorism Act, and FISA.
This ONE INCIDENT caused most of what we are fighting today. This ONE INCIDENT was the most significant historical moment of our lives. This ONE INCIDENT caused the country to take the course it is now.
deleted. mispost.
deleted. mispost.
911 boxster
LTBJorgaard- 'Rings on a pole'. the pole doesn't collapse though does it?
You drop a 5 books onto a pile of 20 books what happens? (Or if you like, - 20 empty wooden boxes the same size and construction as the five boxes dropped (From zero height or one box width) Or you could play jenga with empty hollow bricks-all the same.
'I always think of all you canvassors and precinct leaders and delegates at the front line and caucuses.
Good luck out there &Thank you. You're a gift.
LOL
Nice way to completely distort what I was saying.
I used the "rings on a pole" analogy simply to explain why you would have seen dust ejections simultaneously on all four sides.
The book on dust statement was so you could have a mental picture of how a collapsing floor could eject dust.
a better analogy would be drop 5 books on 20 books which are held up with popsicle stick in between each book (making appropriate provisions to counter the bending moment at the corners. That is unless you are claiming that the WTC was a monolithic solid core structure all the way up to the point of impact. I heard there were like offices or something in the building, hard to do if its filled in solid like your stack of 20 books.
The simple fact of the matter is neither you book or box analogy comes anywhere close to resembling a steel building let alone the twin tours.
Very well said--that's an
Very well said--that's an excellent analogy.
SUPPORT OUR FOUNDERS' AMERICA
Support the Constitution of the United States
great post....
bump.
Controlled demolition
I had a thought reading this. Since it is now proven that a very large building can come down in it's own footprint simply by cutting the support structure in just a few floors near the top part of the building wouldn't it make sense that all controlled demolitions would now apply this new knowledge in all future demolitions? Sure would be cheaper and easier, right? Explosives aren't cheap. Just put some in a few floors around say half the structural supports and then the weight of the floors above will do all the rest. We now have three instances of this being proven effective,
right? Makes sense to me.
Bet you $1000 dollars you can't find any demolition firm in the world who uses this new, proven, quick and economical method of collapsing a building. Wonder why?
Guess all these experts aren't so smart and they like to spend weeks preparing a building and spending huge amounts on explosives which we all know now aren't really necessary and are just overkill.
the intellectual dishonesty is getting old...
Who says it is a quick or economical method? Sounds to me like this high tech thermate is pretty expensive.
Also, since so many people are ignorant of these reports, you really think there is going to be some change in the way demolitions are traditionally done?
See what you have offered is exactly what haightashbury was talking about. We can argue all day long back and forth in this manner, endlessly squabbling about things which don't really have any substance. More half baked little theories and points with no evidence and no science.
I think you should stick to the 9/11 rumor threads, leave the science up to people capable of critical thinking and intellectual honesty.
THANK YOU for this post...
"Because 9/11 is that absolute backbone of everything that has been happening. Every neocon has rested their political career on it, every police state measure and war measure rests upon it, the entire credibility of the MSM depends upon 9/11 truth not coming out. If we can break 9/11, then we bring down the entire establishment in one fell swoop. It is the Achilles tendon of the criminals in government and the media, and it is vitally important to expose 9/11 and set everything straight once and for all...."
I couldn't have stated the above any better. And for those of you on here who still DON'T GET IT, PLEASE reread the above statement very slowly until you understand what exactly is being said. And then read it again.
Hear Ye! Hear Ye!
This is why this dire subject has so much "intestinal fortitude", so to speak!
Prove 9/11
bring down the establishment like the twin towers.
So true, so true and that is why 9/11 is soooo relevant, to all the people who say 9/11 hurts the Ron Paul movement. I was well into the movement before I started believing the government had a major hand in covering a whole lot up from 9/11.
These 911 and other
These 911 and other conspiracy threads are what keep me away from this sight.