I don't think this will be a popular opinion, but could it be that the stock marekt is starting to bottom?
Posted July 20th, 2008 by GREEDisBAD
output
Some people expressed some concerns about some of the people behind the movie I.O.U.S.A.
Could it be that the stock market would be turned around for a while to discredit people like us until the election is over?
I am no expert and I don't know what might happen, but I think I see some indications of the stock market bottoming.
What's your take?
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The market is not going to go down to zero
That's all the advice I have for you.
Personally
I think we are going to see a rally within a bear market in the next few weeks.
Look at the oil price: this is mainly the reason for the rally, because it sunk substantially in a few days, but is still very high.
Just prior to the Weimar
hyper-inflationary experience, there was a short-lived rally in equities. Who buys the financial stocks that seem to be leading the stock rallies (besides the PPT)? Is there any valid reason to believe that any market today is free from manipulation? If the Congress gives the Treasury the blank check that Paulson asked for last week, you and I (the US taxpayers) will be the new owners of several over-priced equities that will rally the DOW and S&P in the short term. Then when it's time, the equities will crash and we (US taxpayers) will be left holding the bag of worthless paper. Sarge is right, we've been set up and it will be our responsibility to see that just retribution is swiftly administered.
agreed
its a false rally
PPT driven.
http://www.flickr.com/pho...
Over a $quadrillion
in bad OTDs sounds awfully bad to me, but what do I know.
You'll know when...
the news will be about being at the bottom and there is terrible depression. then the market will give its final death throw and disintegrate....
People...you need to organize with your neighbors so you can conduct work and trade for services and try to work out something you can sell the other cities towns states.. whatever....
drive yourself....
make your own markets....
you don't have to wait to become
independent.
Rich dad said the biggest
Rich dad said the biggest crash in stock market history is still coming.
He doesn't sound like a very
He doesn't sound like a very 'smart dad'.
Probably not
No...this recent gain was not maniupluation...it was simply a little bounceback....the market had some real fear driven selling in the previous weeks, and a little bit of good news on the financials, along with a small commoditiy correction drove the market up.
This is not going to turn into a boom, as there are some bad days ahead...but it appears that the fallout of the mortgage crisis may be limited. There's still a lot of fear in the market, and it probably will linger for a few months.
Expect to see a lot of bouncing in the next few months...but it'll probably not gain traction in either direction.
lol
you still watch TV.
___ _____ _____ _____ ______ ______ _____ ___
“Revolutions never go backward.”
Wendell Phillips
good news on financials??
good news on financials?? why do you believe everything the idiots tell you on the tv?
Jim Sinclair’s Commentary
Have you acted to protect yourself? This type of event has only one way to go, from California to Maine.
WaMu, now there is a kettle afraid of the pot. Can you wait 8 weeks to eat?
WaMu wary of IndyMac cashier's checks
More strange doings tonight surrounding the failure and federal takeover of IndyMac: some rival banks are refusing to honor cashier's checks written by IndyMac -- even though those checks are backed by the federal government.
John Bovenzi, the FDIC official now running IndyMac, tells the Los Angeles Times today he is "deeply troubled by reports that there are financial institutions that are refusing to honor or are placing excessive holds on IndyMac Federal checks."
On latimes.com tonight: "Sheryl MacPhee, 46, said she liquidated a certificate of deposit at IndyMac's San Marino branch Tuesday morning after a two-hour wait. She then took the cashier's check to a Washington Mutual branch in South Pasadena to deposit.
"MacPhee said a WaMu manager told her that under a new corporate policy, the bank was not accepting IndyMac checks. If a customer insisted on depositing the check, it could be eight weeks or more before the full amount would be accessible.
More…
IndyMac to WaMu?
You've got to be kidding me lady. Out of the frying pan and into the fire. Do some basic internet research Sheryl!
Maybe,
They are afraid to cash them because it would collapse the federal government?
they don't trust that
they don't trust that governments money is any good! lol.. that is who the check is from!
as for me and my home, we shall worship the LORD
lol..........................
lol.................................................................
as for me and my home, we shall worship the LORD
Reply to SSgT_AF. Yes, I agree that we have inflation today, BUT
as I wrote earlier, I believe that this inflation is created by borrowed money. In my opinion, as inflation gets worse by more borrowed money, we get closer to deflation and the risk of deflationary collapse gets worse.
I'd like to use pulling a rubber band as an analogy. To me, creating inflation by borrowing money is like pulling a rubber band. In this analogy, pulling the rubber band is borrowing money and the stretching rubber band is the increasing money supply or inflation. As you pull the rubber band further, you might let go the rubber band by accident or the rubber band might snap at one point and the rubber band will contract very quickly. And the contraction of the rubber band is deflation in this analogy. This is the kind of deflationary collapse that I'm worried about.
Of course, it is extremely difficult to forecast when the rubber band is let go by accident or it might snap.
However, it is my opinion that deflation would hurt this nation more than inflation, therefore, I think it is prudent to prepare for such an event.
"Only a virtuous people are capable of freedom. As nations become corrupt and vicious, they have more need of masters." Benjamin Franklin
---
greed..... what does ron
greed..... what does ron Paul say in the last sentence of this paragraph?
The financial crisis, still in its early stages, is apparent to everyone: gasoline prices over $4 a gallon; skyrocketing education and medical-care costs; the collapse of the housing bubble; the bursting of the NASDAQ bubble; stock markets plunging; unemployment rising; massive underemployment; excessive government debt; and unmanageable personal debt. Little doubt exists as to whether we'll get stagflation. The question that will soon be asked is: When will the stagflation become an inflationary depression?
You will have both!
as for me and my home, we shall worship the LORD
I.E.
Biflation. Which is where we stand today. The deflation point of view stands on the borrowing of money. Are you speaking of citizen debt or global debt. Like the US to China or From me to Frenny Mayac? A home loan or a asset loan? From where I see it we are printing more money and not stopping. Hence deflation is headed off at the pass and put to bed. The way to hold that back is to pump the money into everything. Luckily for the FED they just send their money to their buddies and keep them afloat. Meanwhile we the nobodies will suffer while they still hold their lavish parties. Just like the French,Russians,English, and Romans before us. We will make them pay. The day will come when history repeats itself.
Slip sliding away
Paul Simon "Slip sliding away, the nearer your destination, the more you're slip sliding away". They seem to be taking it away in increments. Right now anyway.
For the record ...
Do not believe anyone that is predicting the future below.
I will say that I am a bear for the short term and the long term regarding the domestic market.
Having said that, I am an optimist with respect to the human race.
For what it is worth.
WAHOR!!
What's the point of saying "Do not believe anyone...."
and then give your own "prediction". Pretty flakey.
We are not predicting the future. The future is happening.
Bank failure.
Dollar failure.
Real estate failure.
Petrodollar failure.
Impending attack on Iran.
Derivatives.
Historical debt.
Negative savings rate.
Increasing unemployment.
The Plunge Protection Team and the Gold Cartel.
Bernanke's stalemate in regard to interest rates.
They are my sages and I respect their wisdom.
___________
Lisa C.
www.dvds4delegates.com=Ron Paul, the 44th U.S. President_★
“Elections are short term efforts; revolutions are long term projects.”
--Ron Paul
Join the rEVOLution here: www.campaignforliberty.com
laws of austrian economics
laws of austrian economics doesnt give a hoot about the human race...
the human race has collapsed every economy in human history.. it won't change now!
as for me and my home, we shall worship the LORD
No.
I think you'll see the DOW equal the price of gold at some point.
We are on our way into the "Very Great Depression" and we'll see the middle-class all but disappear.
"May you live in interesting times."
___________
Lisa C.
www.dvds4delegates.com=Ron Paul, the 44th U.S. President_★
“Elections are short term efforts; revolutions are long term projects.”
--Ron Paul
Join the rEVOLution here: www.campaignforliberty.com
It's bottoming alright, tight to the toilet seat
for the final journey into oblivion.
NOPE!
I don't think so!
In not the to distant future
In not the to distant future you will see the stock market at 5000 and gold at $5000.
Make a note of this and see if I'm not right.
"You are a den of vipers. I intend to rout you out and by the Eternal God I will rout you out. If the people only understood the rank injustice of our money and banking system, there would be a revolution before morning." --Andrew Jackson,
1828
What in the world would you
What in the world would you base this on? "Bad feelings"?
And what kind of a prediction uses "in the not too distant future"?
Try a little harder and come up with some solid reasons and real research before any more guesses.
kbye
I hope so
I like your tag line too.Libera me, let the truth break, what my fears make--Leslie Phillips
They are trying to keep the dollar afloat until after....
....the election. Peter Schiff said that the price of gold and the stock market will meet. The price of gold is about $954 (as of today) and the NYSE was at about 11496, give or take 5 points. Schiff is the most mocked investor on Wall St., he is known as Dr. Doom. The thing is, Schiff has been 100% right so far. If I had any money it would get invested in anything Mr. Schiff recommended. (I think he would make an excellent Presidential candidate).
I like Peter as well but, as a candidate, people would try to
use his dad's past battles with the government, particularly with the IRS, against him......and you know how mudballing tends to work.
_________________________________________
"An economy built on fiat money is a society on its way to ashes."
The thinking these days is
The thinking these days is that there will continue to be more highly publicized bank failures, there will definitely be more airline failures, and the real estate market will continue to be soft (if not downright squishy) for another year to year and a half at least. If you "know what you're doing" in stocks, you can make a bear OR a bull market work for you. If you are a 'long' instead of a day trader, you'll eventually gain your paper wealth back. If you're a day trader, you may have gotten severely burned with the drop in the market, which is not necessarily a bad thing. The market has a way of punishing those who don't know what they are doing.
Hold onto your stocks if you can and let it play out over the next few years. If you act like a fool, you'll be at the whim of smarter, more patient investors.
Check out the Sanctus Germanus Prophecies. , Vol 1&2
Freedom is not FREE!!
This is like being in the twilight zone. I read these book when first published. Truth is truth whether anyone sees it or not. It cannot be stopped and the next couple of years are going to be the hardest. You must learn to be of service to mankind expecting nothing in return. May Peace be brought forth from each of you.
All of the markets are a swindle to take money from the average citizen and re-distribute your wealth to the elite dark forces in our world.
Do not believe the government, media, organized religion, and in some cases your own mind. Each and every one of us must seek the answers within. Meditate and look for the light within to gain your answer. No one may give it to you. Only you can gain the light and receive your true path to enlightenment.
Ask Kahn if I am not close. I do not personally know him but something tells me he has seen that inner light. That is what peace is about.
The government has been moving to criminalize the act of
"talking down" the market (as well as the stability of the fractional reserve banking system). That's part of their conventional strategy which has served them so well in the past; that is, shift the blame to others who in fact have nothing to do with the problem. There's a pretty good article covering this subject at:
http://freedominourtime.b...
I have no doubt that government officials would love for everyone to believe that the market has indeed "bottomed" and there will be a certain portion of the population who will, for whatever reason or motivation, take the government's explanation or allegations as factual. One of the difficulties in determining a "bottom" for the stock market is that the measurements are published based upon U.S. dollars and, with the actual value of the dollar moving downward over time, the published numbers do not actually represent an accurate presentation of the "wealth" that people are normally inclined to assign to such published figures. For an extreme example of this, if you "valued" the U.S. stock market in terms of the Zimbabwe dollar, the DJIA would be astronomic, but then what is a Zimbabwe dollar worth? Evidently, it keeps getting worth less and less, nearly by the hour, as the government there has found it necessary to start issuing 100 Billion dollar notes in the face of price inflation that independent economists have estimated to be somewhere between 10 to 15 million percent.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/a...
Can't happen here? It's as if one held one's wealth in Alka Seltzer tablets during a rain storm.
_________________________________________
"An economy built on fiat money is a society on its way to ashes."
Really interesting article
I have been watching this latest tactic to shift the blame. They blamed IndyMac on the Senator ( I think Shumer is his name) but where were the regulators when the bank was not even on their list? Where are they with Freddie and Fannie when one of the top CEOs from those institutions made per reports over $20 million last year. God forbid any one should warn people about their life savings. I wonder if they will use the new FISA act to monitor if anyone is saying what they don't want to be said.
I would have to research the law to find the actual
statutory provision that I'm thinking about, but in the late 70s there was fellow named Howard Ruff I used to listen to from time to time. He used to have a program called: Ruff House. During that period, I recall him speaking out about the growing instability of the fractional reserve banking system. Evidently, his remarks drew the attention of officials in the U.S. government. In one segment, I remember him reading aloud a letter sent to him by some regulatory agency in which they reminded him that it was a federal crime to cast doubt (aka: tell the truth) about the stability of federally insured banks. The "law" was established during the FDR administration. I would have to do some research in order to find the exact statute, but I was amazed (and I shouldn't have been) that the government would actually move to intimidate or threaten someone who was expressing their own opinion.
_________________________________________
"An economy built on fiat money is a society on its way to ashes."
bottom?
If you mean it is the bottom and we'll not go lower, probably not. but I do plan to do some short-term speculation here with some of my 'dry powder' (cash). There are a lot of very high quality companies that have huge 'on sale' signs on them right now.
They have a
time line and we are not privileged to it. Anything is possible. Peace
witht the TRILLIONS just
with the TRILLIONS just issued to bail out huge financial institutions you have to know that some of that money will find its way to wall street! just prolonging the inevitable dow of 2500 or lower! the dollar did not go up!
were still in crash mode... nothing goes straight up or down!
as for me and my home, we shall worship the LORD
Yes
Yes this is the bottom. Sell all your gold and silver and put your money in stocks. Ha ha Ha. LOL , ROTFL
You crack me up!
What signs do you see?
There are always sucker rallies during bear markets and it is hard to predict when, how and why they will happen beforehand, but the fundamental problems haven't changed one bit and in fact have only gotten worse.
Free and Brave
or Cradle to Grave
You can't have both
You’re correct regarding your subject.
It crashed on July 1st. A few looptyloops have occured since then.
On the body text… Even though I have a six year college/professional background in non-traditional (i.e. a dollar is a dollar; a Federal Reserve Note is a minus balance) finances, your guess is no doubt better than mine.
--Cliff, Sioux City, Iowa
Down market pull back,created so pro's can enter short positions
Something is going to break, and soon. Banks are insolvent and failing by the hundreds if not thousands. Hedge funds are on the edge of oblivion. Only a tiny percentage of toxic waste losses in real estate and other asset classes of collateral, which will eventually amount to over $1.4 trillion in the US alone, has to date been recognized by the lying bankster fraudsters. Bonds are producing negative rates of return even based on ludicrously understated official rates of inflation (until this month, when we finally got some data bordering on the truth). Credit markets are frozen, and few can get financing at favorable rates. Banks won't even lend to one another because they do not trust each other's financial statements, which are all bogus.
rense.com http://www.rense.com/gene...
suckers rally
*
on a tangent (but the parent
on a tangent (but the parent post got me thinking about it)....
What's the relationship between deflation and a strong dollar?
It seems that strengthening the dollar (i.e. fewer in circulation), would cause prices of goods and services to drop.
If we are currently suffering from inflation, things are expensive, the dollar is weak.
It also seems that productivity/production is down.
Is this one of those "first by inflation, then by deflation" things?
very confusing.
Deflation would hurt this nation more than
hyper-inflation, in my opinion.
"Only a virtuous people are capable of freedom. As nations become corrupt and vicious, they have more need of masters." Benjamin Franklin
---
Your Opinion
Has always been strongly flawed.
Why? Would not deflation hurt debtors more than hyper-infaltion?
"Only a virtuous people are capable of freedom. As nations become corrupt and vicious, they have more need of masters." Benjamin Franklin
---
hmmmm
Lets stay away from the What ifs and stick to the what is. What is happening compared to your opinion is flawed. Yet if we just wanted to say "what if" then I could say a meteor heading to earth would hurt debtors more than deflation. What is happening now I believe is a biflationary inflation leaning economic downward spiral caused by controlled events and manipulators aimed solely at the total debasement of the dollar to an absolute zero. Hello Amero.
SSgT_AF, isn't today's inflation created by borrowed money?
Does not more inflation by more borrowed money mean bad deflation sometime in the future when the borrowed money must be paid back?
"Only a virtuous people are capable of freedom. As nations become corrupt and vicious, they have more need of masters." Benjamin Franklin
---
that cleared it up for me.
that cleared it up for me. ok not really. I thought I was following you till you hit us with the:
What is happening now I believe is a biflationary inflation leaning economic downward spiral.
ahhhh....hold on I went to look up "biflation" ....
Definition: Biflation is the state of an economy where the processes of inflation and deflation occur simultaneously. During this period there is a rise in the purchasing prices of commodity items and a fall in the purchasing prices of non-commodity items.
OK....sounds just like what we're experiencing. So what comes next? The spiral? OK. I got that too.
Here's the question then...is there a point before we hit "worthless currency", i.e. before the amero (and I say "before", because maybe this process will take several years), is there a point when deflation is across the board even for commodities?
If so, would it be wise to have some dollars, because of generalized deflation? i.e. the prices of everything is going to fall, and for a year or two before the actual collapse of the dollar....things are cheap for those holding dollars.
What if this isn't the time that the dollar actually is done away with...what if that's to be another time.
I guess what I'm saying is, I've got gold and silver, should I also hold a few dollars just in case?