Massive Civil Disobedience similiar to the 1960's may again be needed to reign in the government!
Posted August 26th, 2008 by Ralph Waldo
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As anyone from the 1960's can tell you, there are many parallels between the RP revolution and that tumultous decade. Up against an arrogant administration, it eventually became apparent that acts of civil disobedience were the only things that worked.
CD was used by numerous movements including the civil rights movement, women's rights, and the environmental movement. However, the greatest achievement of civil disobedience by far, was the stopping of the Vietnam war. After it was over, most people from that time never imagined we'd see the rise of another, EVEN MORE fascist and arrogant regime.
The point is this - Don't be naive! It wasn't easy then and it ain't gonna be easy this time either! If you want to see what it may very well take to change this country, take a look at the widespread, massive and persistent acts of civil disobedience from the 1960's!
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A Word of caution
I can Only say this becasue I have to check myself every once in a while NOT to drift into "mob mentality" and not one of you doesn't know what I'm talking about.
This absolutely must be a battle of the BRAINS. Intelligence MUST be the winner if the war is to be fought.
I want to get involved in civil disobedience in any way, at any time I know it will be effective. However for me to loose a battle in this day and age I could easily loose my life and not be effective - bad for the side I'm fighting for and me.
If you want to stop this run away train you have to play for keeps. It's an electric train - pull the plug. It runs on gas - starve it of fuel or oxygen.
It runs on money - bankrupt it...oops, they are already self desctucting..What now Robin? The police are a minority force, evil has them out numbered, cities go under and can't pay the police. The police won't work for free, out numbered with a target on their forhead...But I digress.
The Democrats have raised the bar. Every one must jump over it. Their FIRST PRIORITY - - - Unification. United we stand. We've seen this movie.
We know how it plays out. Remember Kent State. No one has to give up thier life but you know for an absolute certainty it's going to happen.
Then, the shock of the kill sets in. Ask ANY vet what that feels like. Ask them how it changes you. Ask anyone who has had their innocence ripped away from them......Ask for a plan. Ask for help. Ask for a leader.
ASK HOW YOU CAN ''''''''DO''''''''' SOMETHING. Now! I'm asking and I'm listening. What about you?
As RP has said it is a philosphical war of words and ideas!
!
Why is Robert Schulz of WE THE PEOPLE denied speech time?
Copy of letter to Rally for the Republic:
TO DR.RON PAUL AND ORGANIZERS OF THE MINNESOTA RALLY, Greetings;
Across the nation, many of us have supported Ron Paul since his first run for President as well as the valiant efforts of Robert Schulz and We the People. NEVER would we have thought that Dr.Paul would deny this patriot Schulz an opportunity to speak at the Rally. The power struggle between these two factions risks all that we work for and suggests that we are misguided by those representing this Revolution as surely as we have been deceived by our acting government. We who are members of both "Campaign for Liberty"(87,339 members) AND "We the People"(81,905 members) find this staff acting irrespective of our wishes by dividing our numbers, holding us hostage to one group instead of uniting both. This folly represents us no better than the traitors who enslave us. Of all your speakers, only Dr.Paul has had a more unifying effect than Schulz.
If Bob Schultz is not permitted to speak, many of us will not attend the Rally in Minnesota. You divide us perilously.
I urge you for the good of the country to grant to Schulz his request to speak. Stop this most distasteful and dangerous bickering before you destroy our work. You behave as petty county organizers, isolating memberships for fear of "losing power". Our leaders, our numbers, our personality conflicts mean nothing if we are not united against the foe.
ACT IN THE INTEREST OF THE REPUBLIC OR STEP ASIDE!
Motorgrader1
I did not know Bob was
I did not know Bob was denied a speaking role. The schedule is set, tho, and maybe there is not time..? Maybe the Petition made Ron mad? Hmm..I really do not get it. Are you certain RP made the decision? I belonged to WTP way before RP..in fact, I think I heard about RP from Bob. It would be a royal shame if they do not allow him to speak..BUT please be sure RP gets the message. C4L has NEVER responded to me when I wrote or when I called and left a message, so I am already considering supporting them, but giving up my membership. I mean, if they do not respond to each member, who needs another top down organization in their life (DON'T get mad at me, anyone, this is how I feel, not how you have to..)
Bob Schulz (We the People) should have speaking time at Rally
Hopefully Dr. Paul does not know of this action by the C4L staff and will immediately grant Schulz speaking time. Whatever is going on, the Revolution is compromised by the short-sighted actions of the C4L committee. Schulz has worked tirelessly to ensure that all legal avenues have been petitioned by the people. We have advanced greatly at his lead. While the government mocks us, we remain divided into many groups, our numbers isolated. Who gave these groups that right? Isn't that what this Rally all about? Uniting our numbers? Why reject 82,000 members of We the People?
All the information is on the We the People Foundation's new site:
http://givemeliberty.org/...
He has
my vote to speak at the Rally .Strength in numbers.
Delegates Revolt!!! For the people by the people!
~Delegates~ Vote Ron Paul First Round or Sit Down...
I have attached a Golden Fema Ticket for those of you who vote for McCain in the first round.
__________________________
http://i537.photobucket.c...
Oh yeah?
It would be easier if we grew some balls like these Americans.
http://jpfo.org/filegen-a...
Did you know that delegates to the Republican National Convention should never, under any circumstances vote for John McCain? Instead, they should vote for Dr. Ron Paul; because, after all, a vote for Ron Paul is a vote for freedom.
This was a great read. The
This was a great read. The thing is that these GI's had "right" on their side, 1500 more "troops" coming in from nearby counties, and the cops wanted to get home to their families. It may have been different even at the DNC if 5000 people had "protested"..but what were they really protesting? These people were protesting illegal vote fraud. They were right. Even people with high tech weapons may not feel like firing them on a formidable force like this. Besides, a little dynamite is as formidable as a microwave weapon. Dead is dead, no matter how you are dispatched.
The difference between the guns owned by the
citizens and those owned by the government were not that great in the 1950's. With today's high tech weaponry, the difference is enormous.
You can't win a shooting war with the US military, however as RP as stated, this is a philosophical war, a war of words and ideas!
Actually, you CAN win a shooting war
with light infantry. I have a short story on my website about people doing just that: www.axiomaticeconomics.co...
did that even work in the
did that even work in the 60s? I don't know, I wasn't alive then.... but it seems to me that it's only mocked and not taken seriously, and never was at the time either....
The powers that be have made a concerted effort
to distort the grassroots rebellion of the sixtes. Not only did it work, it was the only thing that worked.
Peace advocates like the Kennedys, ML King and John Lennon were all killed, as well as students in various places like Kent State. The establishment hated the war protestors but they eventually won out and had a lot to do with Nixon who was driven from office.
The student protests of the sixites is the reason there in no draft today!
Egg-zactly, aVoiceof Reason
It was considered extreme for those days, but the troops abanodoned the cause and went and got high and got laid.
We had a sex, drug and rock 'n roll revolution.
As we know in hindsight, things are far worse now. And I believe right down to my toes that this time around it is going to take armed conflict.
I wish it weren't so. And I hope it doesn't devolve into civil war.
The regime would love that trajectory to justfy all sorts of excessive force.
"Committed To The Eradication Of Poverty Among Patriots"
Those who control the MSM would like for you to believe that the
Sixties were only about sex, drugs and rock and roll. That makes a nice little tidy and negative package!
If you want to find out what it was really about, listen to the lyrics of the Beatles, Crosby Stills and Nash, Joan Bias, Richie Havens and Jackson Brown.
The Sixties were like the RP revolution times 10!!!!!!!!!!!!
I was in high school in
the 60's. There was a revolution all right, but it wasn't pretty. It's when our society began rapidly falling apart. Common decency and manners started going by the wayside. As it turned out, free love wasn't love after all, and it wasn't free either-- we have paid dearly for it with divorce, abortion, child neglect, and the over 50 STD's that are prevalent now (in high school we were taught about the three venereal diseases).
That was my generation. When my kids went to university in the early 2000's, they would tell me that the other students wanted to live good and happy lives, but that they didn't know how. It is no wonder the students are so lost.....their parents are mostly divorced, and for example, when the university has "Mom's Weekend" the students' moms go and sleep around with the frat boys!! The emergency room at the local hospital always has to brace themselves for the flood of alcohol poisoning cases involving these middle-aged women, the moms.
Like Pogo said, "We have met the enemy, and he is us." The government we have and the mess we are in is a reflection of us. We won't get anything better until we become a better people.
Somehow, I don't think the 60's is what Ron Paul has in mind.
The topic of this tread is about Civil Disobedience
It was first put into print by Henry David Thoreau. It was adopted with great success by Gandhi and then later replicated by Martin Luther King.
However, the biggest success of it's relative short history was by far, its use in stopping the Vietnam war in the 1960's.
I'm sure RP knows all about it and has made recent reference to CD as an option that might be needed to reign in an out of control government.
Currently the RP revolution is but a fraction of the number of people who protested the actions of the Johnson and Nixon administrations.
The point I'm trying to make, despite all the off topic discussions, is that it might take a lot more people, with a lot more fire-in-their-bellies to restore constitutional government to this country.
I don't get my reality from TV
I lived through the 60's, rode a bus to school, through the burned out city after MLK's assasination, saw my buddies killed in Vietnam, and watched others end up drug addicted. Sweat the draft - got saved by a high lottery number.
"Beatles, Crosby Stills and Nash, Joan Bias, Richie Havens and Jackson Brown." Just words... gives the mind a cookie. Feels like real change. Didn't change anything. Pacified the outrage. Diminished credibilty of the movement. And ensured the uninterrupted growth of the industrial military complex.
Any questions?
It's going to take overwhelming force to regain control of this nation and it ain't gonna' be pretty...even if we win...even if the Heavens open up and send all manner of Providential aid.
How do I know?
I worked for this scum for 4 years. I ate with them. I drank with them. And I robbed with them. I set the traps and bound the prey. They ain't gonna' walk away peacefully. You have no idea their appetite for power.
http://www.dailypaul.com/...
"Committed To The Eradication Of Poverty Among Patriots"
"Those Who Strive For Excellence Refuse To Fear Mediocrity; They Eradicate It."
If you don't believe the words and music were a powerfull force
behind the civil disobedience of the Sixties then you just weren't listen. Just as Thomas Paine and RP's book used words to rally they troops in their time, so to did the words and music of the Sixtes!
ralphwaldo: OK Brother
Then tell me...show me, what changed.
"Committed To The Eradication Of Poverty Among Patriots"
"Those Who Strive For Excellence Refuse To Fear Mediocrity; They Eradicate It."
The fact that you are even having to ask the question
speaks for itself! Sometimes the obvious requires no further response!
As I thought -- no - thing -- nada
"Committed To The Eradication Of Poverty Among Patriots"
"Those Who Strive For Excellence Refuse To Fear Mediocrity; They Eradicate It."
You obviously were not there or you wouldn't have to ask.
The words and message of the music changed everything - as anyone who was there was well aware.
You should really be more careful about consistently exposing your ignorance on this site, especially considering your history.
ralphwaldo says:
"The words and message of the music changed everything - as anyone who was there was well aware.
You should really be more careful about consistently exposing your ignorance on this site, especially considering your history."
Umm.. I think we're talking about exposing your empty rhetoric, ralphwaldo
see CarrotTop's post above
"Committed To The Eradication Of Poverty Among Patriots"
"Those Who Strive For Excellence Refuse To Fear Mediocrity; They Eradicate It."
Are you the same DaddyWarBucks
accused of being the Daily Paul's biggest blow hard, who was always going to fund the big national PR campaign for RP - that never happened! The same one who always signed off with the bragadocious "go get my checkbook"?
If you want to learn about the history of the sixties, you are going to have to do your own homework Dude. Don't expect me to spoon feed you!
Dude: Your 'green' is showing
For the record, the day we began putting together the National Media Campaign, Ron Paul announced he was cutting back. We had people inside HQ who guided us over the following weeks as we continued to plan our strategy. Their guidance proved out, even though we doubted they're allegiance at the time.
In hindsight, I am grateful that we didn't piss away money for a candidate who wasn't running for a short term goal of being president.
We have been focusing on long term projects, funding patriots directly.
"Committed To The Eradication Of Poverty Among Patriots"
"Those Who Strive For Excellence Refuse To Fear Mediocrity; They Eradicate It."
Well then, the only thing that got pissed away was your
CREDIBILITY! DUDE.
But if I remember correctly, you always had some kind of "Hot Air" excuse!
ralphwaldo: I assembled a national team...
of videographers, a producer, elections experts, advertising experts and even a Constitutional Attorney...at my expense -- no chipins.
What did you do besides bloviate, stalk and flame on DP?
You don't have a clue about me.
"Committed To The Eradication Of Poverty Among Patriots"
"Those Who Strive For Excellence Refuse To Fear Mediocrity; They Eradicate It."
Talk is Cheap
If what you say is true, WHERE is the evidence and end product??????
May I suggest you post a video or some OTHER evidence of what you claim - We shall be waiting!
I have nothing to prove to a detractor
No horn to toot. Just effective action. And I am patient like our enemies. You on the other hand are not. Your talk is cheap. Remember you started this flaming contest not me.
If someone puts up a perspective that you disagree with...it's "wrong", "wrong", "wrong". Like a little tyrant.
You got nothin' better to do?
We're done...
"Committed To The Eradication Of Poverty Among Patriots"
"Those Who Strive For Excellence Refuse To Fear Mediocrity; They Eradicate It."
As I thought you have NA DA
NOTHING, ZIP - to back up your BS! Some things never change, leaving you with many detractors on this site!!!!!!!
the draft
I don't think we will ever see disent like the 60's until a military draft is instituted. This is the reason we will not see a draft.
I was there. I was in the
I was there. I was in the demonstrations. None of your above posts come close to what it was. We did not win, though. Nixon LATER much later and for his OWN dastardly reasons, gave amnesty to those who had run to Canada to evade the draft. You guys who think there is no draft? You must not have a near 18 year old son. They are all REQUIRED to register with the MILITARY before they are 18. NOW. PLUS, they just sent one 20 year old I know into Kuwait (mind you) after he had served over 2 years, and had 2 months left to his service. He knows they are going to keep him in and will not let him out in 2 months. No one can hide in Canada anymore. I was in the heart of the 60's and it is still in my heart. It was not ALL sex, drugs, and rock and roll. There was MUCH more happening. AND we got beat and beaten badly. We did nothing much. We were a large swarm of mosquitoes to the PTB. We caused some trouble..then the militant groups came out..the Weathermen and the Black Panthers and the guys who kidnapped Patti Hearst.. They lost too..did some damage, but LOST.
NONE of us tried to become the enemy. None tried to infiltrate. None wanted to run for office. If we had done then what we are doing now..well, we may have really won long before now..
Bringing an end to the Vietnam War surely counts
something. I can think of no other time in history this has happened.
Carter, not Nixon, granted
Carter, not Nixon, granted amnesty to Vietnam era draft evaders.
A Thought
Riots are cowardly.
Be honest 'n be with integrity.
Take up arms 'n march down the street(s)!
Is the cause just or not.
It would take about 10 million, maybe 5 mill.
... ...
I was pretty young durin' the '60's, remember some parts of the riots in Cincinnati.
I was thinkin'
more along the lines of the 1860s,
The is a differnce between civil disobedience and civil war!
One tries to resolve issues without violience.
"One tries to resolve issues without violence"
Maybe you should tell that to the gov't.
They don't seem to have gotten the memo.
Well we don't want it to esculate to that level
Primarily because they have more and bigger guns. Plus it has been proven that violence begets violence.
I'm down..
And I'll be happy to do it without all the psychotropic drugs. What someone has to stay clear headed to let everyone know it was real.... lol.
sounds like you have been re-educated
dumbed down? I'm from the 60's and I couldn't believe the misinformation in my children's' textbooks about my generation!
Yeap it's a deliberate attempt to discredit the power of the
grassroots!
Name another generation from any country, that has ever risen up and stopped a war, ever!
Ron Paul has suggested that
non-violent civil disobedience may be required... I could see that. I could also see self defense becoming more necessary.
Libera me, let the truth break, what my fears make--Leslie Phillips
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