-> HEY!! Who sponsored the $700B bailout bill???? <-
Submitted by fanofwalt on Wed, 09/24/2008 - 20:06
EDIT: I had originally begun this post with the following:
Excuse me; I hope this isn't too dunderheaded, but...um...
I have a new introduction:
DO WE HAVE EVEN A CLUE AS TO HOW THIS PROPOSAL GOT INTRODUCED TO CONGRESS??
Some more edits, now that some more detective work has been completed, and since the President has addressed the nation:
Can we also please recognize that this is a "PROPOSAL" and NOT a "bill"???
- Yep, this is only "suggested legislation" at this point. The President does have the power to recommend legislation -- Per Article 2, Section 3 of the U.S. Constitution:
[The President] shall from time to time give to the Congress Information of the State of the Union, and recommend to their Consideration such Measures as he shall judge necessary and expedient;
So, okay -- in tonight's speech, Bush said "I proposed..." and "my proposal;" whether that means he alone or his administration or his super secret decoder ring club, he is clearly accepting the responsibility for the proposal. That's, "proposal," because it is not yet a bill, even though everyone's calling it that.
Let's move on --
Can we also please recognize that, per Article 1, Section 7, BILLS to raise revenue can only be introduced in the House of Representatives??
All bills for raising Revenue shall originate in the House of Representatives; but the Senate may propose or concur with Amendments as on other Bills.
That means, in order for something to become a bill, it MUST be sponsored by a member of Congress -- the Prez himself cannot make it a bill.
Some have speculated that, since B.O. and InSane are going to D.C. on Thursday to help the Prez garner support for this proposal, that one or both of those men will sponsor the item to officially introduce it into Congress for a vote.
NO CAN DO: sponsorship MUST be done ONLY by a member of the House of Representatives. B.O. and InSane are both senators.
*** THIS ENTIRE BAILOUT -- PROPOSAL INCLUDED! -- IS THUS FAR UNCONSTITUTIONAL ***
I am REALLY looking forward to finding out who the four members of the House of Representatives are who were reported in the Drudge Report as supporting the proposal. That's who Bush will get to sponsor the piece; you watch.
Okay, I'll stop yelling. You may now read on in peace:
Q. Who introduced this $700B bailout bill?
A: Evidently, Bush is claiming responsibility (although I'm sure he wasn't alone in crafting the piece)
Q. It's been presented to both the Senate and the House, right? All done with both houses?
A. Presented, yes; but, officially voted on? Can't have been, as it is NOT a bill, remember, despite everyone calling it a "bill."
Q. What's the Senate bill number? What's the House bill number?
A. No number assigned yet, because it's not a bill yet!
Q. A bill must be introduced by a member of Congress, right? So who introduced and sponsored (and co-sponsored) this bill?
A. See above. A sponsor may suddenly arise from the House on Thursday.
--
I, uh...don't see any information on this anywhere. I'm a-googling, but I'm coming up dry. What, did the bill appear out of thin air, like so many fiat dollars? Perhaps I myself just missed it.
If you can point me to these details, I'll quickly delete this post. However, did we kinda sorta maybe miss how this bill was even introduced?
...and STILL...not yet a bill.
Just a reminder that with all this crafting and drafting, we STILL do not have a sponsor, and therefore, do not have a bill.
Remember this, if it tries to go to a vote.
Dude,
I am now a fan of "fanofwalt"...
Keep it up, bro!
Yours in Liberty,
Shovel
"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote..." ~ Ben Franklin
"The 'cost of freedom' is risk and responsibility..." ~ Me
Yours in Liberty,
Shovel
"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote..." ~ Ben Franklin
"The 'cost of freedom' is risk and responsibility..." ~ Me
Thanks for the info
I added it to my handout here:
http://www.ronpaulforumpa.com/smf/index.php?topic=887.msg290...
http://killfiat.blogspot.com/
Listening to Bonnie Frank
rant and rave all this week, I'm sure he would step up to the table and sponsor this. Do you?
Just saw this on rense
http://votenobailout.org/
Could be
He is a member of the House of Representatives -- man, that phrase just sticks in my throat, now -- so he certainly could sponsor the proposal and make it a bill.
I'm wondering how quickly this will go from being designated as a bill, and being voted into law. Anyone want to guess?
I wonder what Barney has
I wonder what Barney has stuck down his throat!
I am more concerned about the return of my money than the return on my money. --Mark Twain
"When governments fear the people there is liberty. When the people fear the government there is tyranny."
-Thomas Jefferson
I am more concerned about the return of my money than the return on my money. --Mark Twain
Do we get to fingerprint the crooks who leveraged
the mortgages to depths of hell? Crooks like Paulson?
what is even more interesting
is if you try to see what the article calls a "revised" edition of the bailout, you click the link and you get- the file is damaged and could not be repaired. so there you go- there is a bill that i can't find and the revision of the file is damaged and cannot be repaired
~peace
~peace
ya'll will LOVE this...
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13578_3-9951420-38.html
~peace
~peace
I actually just screamed out loud
The link freespeech posted goes to a story entitled:
Housing bailout bill creates national fingerprint registry
Excerpts:
Take this to the Top
Fanofwalt ,,,
If voting could really change things,
it would be illegal.
THANK YOU for pointing that out.
i would have missed it.
That's very nice. WHERE'S THE FREAKING BILL??
Hi there. It's Saturday, September 27, 2008.
The New York Times is reporting today that a consensus on the Wall Street rescue plan is said to be near.
Excerpt:
Like, um, maybe a BILL NUMBER? And a SPONSOR from the House of Representatives, perhaps?
A few minutes ago (11:30am Pacific time)
I saw that it was at 100 pages and growing
Wow! Good point....
I was so disgusted with the whole thing, my thoughts didn't even go there....good job...
Big bump waiting for an answer...
WTP Federal Lawsuit to BAN ALL ELECTRONIC VOTING
http://www.wethepeoplefoundation.org/UPDATE/Update2009-05-11...
.................................
http://www.enduswars.org/
http://peaceoftheaction.org/
This is still _not_ a bill
Just a reminder: this "proposal" that practically everyone is calling a "bill" is NOT a bill!
It must first be sponsored by a member of the House of Representatives (because it's regarding raising revenue) in order for it to become a bill!
Legislators cannot (legally!) vote on a proposal. Such action would be completely non-binding, except for in the fantasy world of our president and his cohorts in this crime.
Has anyone heard word of this bailout proposal being sponsored and becoming an actual bill? If so, who is the sponsor(s)? I have heard no such information yet, and believe me, I've been looking.
Fan
Let us know. As McCain says I have a pen we'll get their names and make them famous !!
You mean
INFAMOUS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Bob Barr 4 Prez.. 2008
Libertarian Party
Chuck Baldwin 4 Prez.. 2008
Constitutional Party
There is life at the end of the tunnel my friends!
***********Ron Paul for POTUS 2012***********
*************Obama Is A Communist!************
**********Repeal the 17th Amendment**********
Double the size of the House of Representatives
$$$$$$$$$AUDIT THE FEDERAL RESERVE$$$$$$$$$$
Bump
For more debate
In secret. Law breakers can do anything.
--Cliff Treadway, Sioux City, Iowa
—Cliff in Sioux City, Iowa
———————
If you remember anything, remember the throw-away tools of war.
Indeed.
Let's at least try to hold them accountable. Otherwise, why are we here?
You mean, I could just be eating bon bons and watching Days of our Lives all this time? ;)
Apparently,
Do you think Marlena will save John's mind? :)
IT'S DOABLE
Alpacas - IT'S DOABLE
Too late
NO ONE can save his mind.
Oh -- or did you mean a different John? ;)
His mind is not worth saving
(unless you have a different John in mind)
Apparently it was drawn up months ago
http://www.prisonplanet.com/white-house-admits-it-drew-up-ba...
They have been planning this all along
Sick!
That means King Bush has been coming on TV assuring the American people our economy was strong, When he knew all along. he even said tonight in the middle of all this mess that the American people should have confidence blablablabla
What does one more lie mean
in this government's 'ocean of lies'.
Of course he and his cronies have known. They are waiting to make this bailout, the Robbery of robberies, hit off, cream off as much money as they can in this last bid and they are off, to their overseas abodes. The next group of gangsters will continue their work.
They won't hesitate (is my guess) to cause a bloodbath to get what they want.
Bernanke, Paulson, many, many, many Lobbiests
Or so said LouDobbs last night.
In the beginning of a change the patriot is a scarce man, and brave, and hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot.
~Mark Twain
Always remember:
"It does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority keen to set brush fires in people's minds." ~ Samuel Adams
Stay IRATE, remain TIRELESS, and set those BRUSH FIRES everywhere you go and in everything
It is a Proposal, do not believe it is a Bill...
I still say no.....and I will be writing my legislators and telling them to vote no, or they will be sorry.
Paulson wrote it out on a dinner napkin.
’In accordance with the principles of double-think it does not matter if the war is not real. For when it is, victory is not possible. The war is not meant to be won, but it is meant to be continuous.’ (George Orwell, 1984)
’In accordance with the principles of double-think it does not matter if the war is not real. For when it is, victory is not possible. The war is not meant to be won, but it is meant to be continuous.’ (George Orwell, 1984)
HAHAHAHAHA!
----------
"We will never give up. We will never give in." - Dr. Ron Paul
----------
"We will never give up. We will never give in." - Dr. Ron Paul
The ultimate sponsors
are the Rothschilds and the twelve member banks that make up the Fed. The same ones who were in charge during the Great Depression
Typically,
a "proposal for legislation" comes from the President, who cannot legislate, but can make proposals to Congress for legislation that he'd like to advocate.
So, my guess is that this came from Bush, because the Treasury Dept is an Executive Branch agency. All Executive Branch agencies are under the direction of the President.
I'd say that this is so politically toxic, that no Congressman would put his name on it. Bush is on the way out anyway, and he can't look any worse than he already does.
The excuse would likely be that it couldn't go thru normal procedure because of the emergency nature of it. Or some such nonsense as that.
Shrub strikes again.
You're right BigT, BUT...
From Article 2, Section 3:
He can recommend legislation, HOWEVER, the item being considered MUST be introduced and sponsored by a member of Congress; in this case, since it is a matter of raising revenue, specifically by a member of the House of Representatives!!!
THIS CANNOT EVEN BE VOTED ON UNTIL IT IS A BILL!!!!
WHICH IT PRESENTLY IS NOT!!!
Oh golly; there I go, yelling again. Sorry. But -- !!!!!!!!
Watch Obama and McCain
co-sponsor this b.s.
http://RevolutionaryPolitics.com
http://RevolutionaryPolitics.com
Ah, but they CAN'T!!!!
They are both senators.
See Article 1, Section 7:
This proposal MUST be sponsored by a member of the House of Representatives!!
Ooooh -- now, who were those four representatives who voted in favor of the proposal, as mentioned earlier today on the Drudge Report?? Have their names been yet determined??
READY THE TAR AND FEATHERS!
I'll grab my pitch-fork!
http://RevolutionaryPolitics.com
http://RevolutionaryPolitics.com
Yes, I agree that's correct
Maybe they'll package it up and vote on it, and then release the names of the sponsors afterwards.
Maybe.
Or maybe they'll pass it by a voice vote, yays and nays.
So we can't have a list of who voted for it.
Wouldn't that be a kick in the ass?
However, remember that the Patriot Act, and many other miserable acts that were passed, originated from the President as quite voluminous documents, and were just introduced and passed by Congress(without even reading them), in the past.
Perhaps there were some sponsors on them, I didn't really remember.
But, things are not done correctly much anymore, as I'm sure you realize.
At this stage, procedural measures are most typically used to "drag feet" or otherwise slow down a bill, to try to kill it.
Article 1, Section 7 wants to know who started this
Per Article 1, Section 7 of the U.S. Constitution:
Did this $700B bailout bill originate in the House of Representatives? If so, by whom? And if it didn't originate in the House, then toss it in the trash, thank everyone for playing, and send them home.
Go ahead and look through the Constitution and see if you can find where it says that a bill can be introduced to Congress by anyone other than a member of the House or Senate.
Let us know when you find it. Because I'd like to introduce a bill that would create a fund to pay for a month-long vacation at Walt Disney World for every person in the nation.
THE WHITEHOUSE PROPOSED IT
THE WHITEHOUSE PROPOSED IT
"The economy is doing just fine.." - John McCain
-----
A great empire, like a great cake, is most easily diminished at the edges. - Ben Franklin
Hey! BILLS, not proposals, are to be introduced to Congress!!
How did we miss this??????
I not sure,
but I bet it was written by the banking industry, as a template long ago.
Yes, a template
just like the patriot act, military commissions act, and of course the whole bogus 9/11 story!!!!
www.cc2009.us
Bob Schulz 165 minute Webinar
http://www.republicmagazine.com/webinar/bob-schulz-continent...
My Friends
Does anyone have a sharpie. We'll name names and make them famous.
Same neo-cons
that got us into this mess...
Obama = O.ne B.ig A.ss M.istake A.merica
Here's The Draft Proposal as shown on NYTimes site
Text of Draft Proposal for Bailout Plan
www.nytimes.com/2008/09/21/business/21draftcnd.html?bl=&ei=5...
Published: September 20, 2008
LEGISLATIVE PROPOSAL FOR TREASURY AUTHORITY
TO PURCHASE MORTGAGE-RELATED ASSETS
Section 1. Short Title.
This Act may be cited as ____________________.
Sec. 2. Purchases of Mortgage-Related Assets.
(a) Authority to Purchase.--The Secretary is authorized to purchase, and to make and fund commitments to purchase, on such terms and conditions as determined by the Secretary, mortgage-related assets from any financial institution having its headquarters in the United States.
(b) Necessary Actions.--The Secretary is authorized to take such actions as the Secretary deems necessary to carry out the authorities in this Act, including, without limitation:
(1) appointing such employees as may be required to carry out the authorities in this Act and defining their duties;
(2) entering into contracts, including contracts for services authorized by section 3109 of title 5, United States Code, without regard to any other provision of law regarding public contracts;
(3) designating financial institutions as financial agents of the Government, and they shall perform all such reasonable duties related to this Act as financial agents of the Government as may be required of them;
(4) establishing vehicles that are authorized, subject to supervision by the Secretary, to purchase mortgage-related assets and issue obligations; and
(5) issuing such regulations and other guidance as may be necessary or appropriate to define terms or carry out the authorities of this Act.
Sec. 3. Considerations.
In exercising the authorities granted in this Act, the Secretary shall take into consideration means for--
(1) providing stability or preventing disruption to the financial markets or banking system; and
(2) protecting the taxpayer.
Sec. 4. Reports to Congress.
Within three months of the first exercise of the authority granted in section 2(a), and semiannually thereafter, the Secretary shall report to the Committees on the Budget, Financial Services, and Ways and Means of the House of Representatives and the Committees on the Budget, Finance, and Banking, Housing, and Urban Affairs of the Senate with respect to the authorities exercised under this Act and the considerations required by section 3.
Sec. 5. Rights; Management; Sale of Mortgage-Related Assets.
(a) Exercise of Rights.--The Secretary may, at any time, exercise any rights received in connection with mortgage-related assets purchased under this Act.
(b) Management of Mortgage-Related Assets.--The Secretary shall have authority to manage mortgage-related assets purchased under this Act, including revenues and portfolio risks therefrom.
(c) Sale of Mortgage-Related Assets.--The Secretary may, at any time, upon terms and conditions and at prices determined by the Secretary, sell, or enter into securities loans, repurchase transactions or other financial transactions in regard to, any mortgage-related asset purchased under this Act.
(d) Application of Sunset to Mortgage-Related Assets.--The authority of the Secretary to hold any mortgage-related asset purchased under this Act before the termination date in section 9, or to purchase or fund the purchase of a mortgage-related asset under a commitment entered into before the termination date in section 9, is not subject to the provisions of section 9.
Sec. 6. Maximum Amount of Authorized Purchases.
The Secretary’s authority to purchase mortgage-related assets under this Act shall be limited to $700,000,000,000 outstanding at any one time
Sec. 7. Funding.
For the purpose of the authorities granted in this Act, and for the costs of administering those authorities, the Secretary may use the proceeds of the sale of any securities issued under chapter 31 of title 31, United States Code, and the purposes for which securities may be issued under chapter 31 of title 31, United States Code, are extended to include actions authorized by this Act, including the payment of administrative expenses. Any funds expended for actions authorized by this Act, including the payment of administrative expenses, shall be deemed appropriated at the time of such expenditure.
Sec. 8. Review.
Decisions by the Secretary pursuant to the authority of this Act are non-reviewable and committed to agency discretion, and may not be reviewed by any court of law or any administrative agency.
Sec. 9. Termination of Authority.
The authorities under this Act, with the exception of authorities granted in sections 2(b)(5), 5 and 7, shall terminate two years from the date of enactment of this Act.
Sec. 10. Increase in Statutory Limit on the Public Debt.
Subsection (b) of section 3101 of title 31, United States Code, is amended by striking out the dollar limitation contained in such subsection and inserting in lieu thereof $11,315,000,000,000.
Sec. 11. Credit Reform.
The costs of purchases of mortgage-related assets made under section 2(a) of this Act shall be determined as provided under the Federal Credit Reform Act of 1990, as applicable.
Sec. 12. Definitions.
For purposes of this section, the following definitions shall apply:
(1) Mortgage-Related Assets.--The term “mortgage-related assets” means residential or commercial mortgages and any securities, obligations, or other instruments that are based on or related to such mortgages, that in each case was originated or issued on or before September 17, 2008.
(2) Secretary.--The term “Secretary” means the Secretary of the Treasury.
(3) United States.--The term “United States” means the States, territories, and possessions of the United States and the District of Columbia.
Thanks Susan
And that's a wonderful collection of detail.
There's only one problem: it's not a bill. It's a "proposal."
I don't know about the rest of you cats, but when I get a proposal, I like to know who's posing it.
In this case, if it ain't a member of the House of Representatives, AND FURTHER, if it's not in the form of a bill, Alex, then running this pile of paper through Congress is completely and utterly erroneous.
Wonder whether Dr. Paul is available to answer this question...
As Han Solo might say: I'm getting a bad feeling about this.
Not that I wasn't already.
But, um...are we just now realizing that we have no clue as to who introduced this bill to Congress?
Is the full text of this bill available? If so, then the Senate # or House # would be available too, right?
Right??
Or are our Congress Critters voting on a piece of legislation that is not even a piece of legislation --
-- ergo --
-- their "vote" would be meaningless?
Uh...
Uh oh.
This is one of those basic questions that the media
never answers.
Another question should be -
Why are there no alternative free market solution bills?
Seems to be titled "Legislative Proposal"
LEGISLATIVE PROPOSAL FOR TREASURY AUTHORITY
TO PURCHASE MORTGAGE-RELATED ASSETS
Section 1. Short Title.
This Act may be cited as ___________________.
Sec. 2. Purchases of Mortgage-Related Assets.
etc etc