***Questions for zeitgeist debunkers***

almost don't wanna comment-lol anyway, i appreciate your post very much. i almost could have written it myself. i do however have a question about your chosen tag line-

Socrates- The only real evil is ignorance and the only real good is knowledge.

If you feel the way you wrote, then why would you even believe in evil?
fact is, evil is the fear propaganda to keep others from LIFE!!!

if you are ready and willing, check out the "busting loose from the money game" book by robert sheinfeld. it is quite interesting!! it isn't just about money, it is about everything!!

~peace

One is not a name, but expresses the IDEA that God is the same for all and is One, and that we are within that Oneness, whether we recognize it or not.

edited from "The City of The One" http://www.probablefuture.com/The_City_of_One.htm

"Although we since Abraham, to often preach monotheism (belief in one God), mankind seems to wants to own the Deity and therefore call it by the name(s) of its choice and creates separation and disharmony over the silly notion of what to name the one before all names and forms.

Sadly, the notion of One Eternal Energy/Intelligence pervading All and Everything has not yet been integrated by the many parts and often hijacked and misconstrued by the human spiritual hierarchies.

Names and restricted visual or conceptual representations are still trumpeted, worshiped, bowed to, and fought for.

The One has no implied connotation to any religion, and at the same time is the Supreme and only One God of all. Sadly, we do find that many humans find comfort in the sub-divisions and great un-easiness in the idea of the Unity of it all in One. In fact those highly invested in the illusory world of materialism become quite upset at the notion.

The message of The One is about introducing the idea that we are here for a fleeting time (called lifetime) not to own property, land, or "things", but to experience life in the best interconnected and happiest way possible for all.

The dark side of our ancient and enslaving matrix is based on illusory structures, concepts, name calling, gods, sub-gods, spiritual hierarchies, man-infused religions, sectarian spiritual ventures, holographic projections/inserts (extra terrestrials etc...), distorted writings, scientific half-truths and theories, national longing and arrogance, divisions of land and property, class fights, its own illusory system of judgment and karma system, and the extreme exploitation and subjugation of the natural world outside and the inner nature within.

It feeds and props up fearful situations, and anger. It supports, funds, and propels forward anything and any one or group of individuals that will imprison our minds into very primitive and idiotic beliefs.

It is incredibly fearful of real change and true spiritual evolution. It is highly cunning and insidious. It is within all of us and outside of us as a gigantic thought form feeding on our support and energy to continue growing and existing.

It hides under the disguise of all kinds of names, images, and concepts: all preaching national, spiritual or material elitism and separation. The only notion it never hides under is the notion of One, for that very notion is the only one which spells destruction and FINAL extinction to it.

It fears that recognition of One more than anything else.
Ego being absorbed into The One is Ego DEATH.. Ego Fears Death..
Ego FEARS UNITY....

We have suffered enough because of it. We have been repeating, in ever changing cycles, with different and ever more sophisticated tools, these very childish behaviors.

The tools available now to the children in the playground of Creation have reached such destructive potential, that were it not for The One, we would have blown up each other to smithereens many times over.

Don't we have enough problems with the extant three present religions originating from the monotheistic revelation of the patriarch Abraham (whose idea of One God Source energy is still unrealized and unabsorbed by mankind), and all originating from the same One?

Have we lost the belief in the All Potential and Creative magical Divine, and its miracles?"

=======
http://www.nature.com/neuro/journal/v11/n5/abs/nn.2112.html
(what this article says is that when a batter see's a ball leave the pitchers hand it his brain actually determined it's reaction (saw / decoded ) at least 1/2 of a second before it left. In other words your brain is a collander decoding from the higher mind and is operating from 1/2 second to 10 seconds in the FUTURE.

This delay presumably reflects the operation of a network of high-level control areas that begin to prepare an upcoming decision long before it enters awareness..

well, I think you should go out and do it, then.
After all, Peter Joseph would never lie, to get us to throw off our existing systems, just to get us to jump into another vague flowery-sounding one with no details or real way of achieving it. One that's being sold exactly like Communism was sold, and even uses a Hegelian name, "zeitgeist". It would never be a "bait and switch" like Communism was, would it?

What do you need our involvement for?
Why can't those who like it, just go do it?

Oh, that's right!
You need our involvement because it requires a collective to work.
Everyone must participate.
One Hegelian Zeitgeister ain't gonna cut it, is it?
Funny thing about that, huh?
That must be why the whole "movement" is centered around getting "converts", and doesn't need to address any of those tedious details and methods.

Enjoy your collective.
Count me out.

Good assessment of the film. I used to listen to AJ but lately have come to the conclusion that he is all about dis-info and discrediting the freedom movement. He just talks and talks about problems using fear tactics but offers little in the way of solutions. His bullhorn tactics and screaming at Michelle Malkin( even though she's a neocon biotch ) do nothing but make our movement look silly. Maybe Zeitgeist fails to fully explain how you reach this utopia it speaks about, but its vision in my mind is very compatible with what I'd call freedom. I think getting rid of currency is one of the main steps in becoming truly free. The main hangup most of the detractors have is the part showing people shedding their religious ideologies and beliefs. That part is mostly aimed at fake Christians like those who supported Bush and believed war was what Jesus would do. Nowhere in the film does it say that you can't believe in or practice your religion. My belief is that people like AJ are trying to discredit the idea that there can be a one world utopia based on true freedom( sort of a good NWO ) by likening it to the evil elitist bad NWO. Maybe the key to peace and freedom is the unification of all human beings under the banner of liberty that us in the RP revolution believe in. Our own world freedom order to combat the other. Just my thoughts. Peace

.

I'll never change your mind.
Besides, I'm planning on being a manager so I can make you change bearings on robot arms while I smoke weed and wallow in the newly found bliss.
I hope for your sake that someone invents a lemonade making robot, there's going to a lot of work to do.
Actually, maybe we could just breed deltas to do the work.

To school your gullible ass. ;)
Read some theosophic and luciferian stuff in the meantime.

of the means of production is anti-liberty. Basic to liberty is the right of the individual to own property, including property that are a means of production --- businesses, land, etc. A society that doesn't allow that is not a free society.

Zeitgeist is communist and therefore anti-liberty.

It is an interesting movie and it's ideas deserve respect. Not the paranoid ranting and nonsense we have seen in other threads.

it is outdated."

I have not seen the movie. I will not comment on any other part. I can however tell you with absolute certainty that force of arms will always have its place in the world.

I have been doing a little bit of research into this and it is very disturbing to me. We are entering into "David Icke Land" with this stuff. Have you guys seen the seal? Here is a link: http://www.austheos.org.au/symbol.htm
If you research the symolism in the seal not only does each sign have it's own meaning but when they are used together the meaning takes on a life of it's own... and I mean literally. I found this information from Egyptologist Judy Kay King: http://www.h-net.org/announce/show.cgi?ID=153897
Halfway down the page is some reference to "Biosemiotics". Here is what it says:
Biosemiotics is all levels of biological sign processes. This transdisciplinary science holds that biology is the basis of all signs and sign interpretation, as Egyptian texts support. Ancient religious signs such as the Star of David, the cross or swastika, the ankh, and the ouroboros match DNA and protein formations found in HGT and lytic transformation. As King explains, “When four major ancient signs are observable in one specific biological process involving viral DNA, it is reasonable to pay attention to the evolutionary message.”
If you guys have ever listened to some of the freaky stuff David Icke talks about he references the Egyptians playing around with DNA. I'll have to post some video of that when I get some time. I myself am not into that but I think it's important to know what these New World Order freaks are into. If you research this "Jiddu Krishnamurti" guy you'll find that they paraded this guy around the world on speaking tours to promote this b.s. The footage in Zeitgeist probably came from one of these tours. All I have to say is this stuff is in the twilight zone and we should definitely proceed with caution.
http://RevolutionaryPolitics.com

but I listened to PJ on Alex Jones. Now I know there is no reason to watch Addendum because PJ is nothing but a megalomaniac with no respect for anything but his own opinions and beliefs. He has the makings of a real fascist in him if anyone thought he were actually worth listening to. Any time people with an atheist aganda encounter opposition, they say any argument that isn't founded on their "creed" isn't plausible. Well, I have news for them. You don't have to be anti-God to be intellectual. In fact, an argument can be made that any truly intelligent person must admit the existence of a higher being.
Bottom line:
If you want to be a disciple of Peter Joseph, check your intelligence and free will at the door.

They fear Zeiteist for reasons they don't understand or will not reveal. You are correct. Their reasons for disliking the film make no sense and do not relate to the film's message. I've been posting that over and over. It's almost like they are trying to create another film. Make up another message. The movie Zeiteist is very different.

List of my original questions to help them get answered

1.My question is how can a socialist utopia created by the NWO surrounded by new age religeons as alex jones and burmas and e. griffin propose be called the message of zeitgeist??

2. Who would enforce any kind of socialism or re-education or prison system for disentors if the ideas of zeitgeist were taken to heart? No where in the film does it advocate these forces and it actually demonizes them.

3. Second socialism requires the central banking and central planning concept. Now as if these ideas aren't being used enough today in the current soceities that control us, in any socialist utopia these central institutions would be a neccesity correct?

4. Now socialism also requires their to be a hierarchy of wealthy elite which is automatically created in ANY monetary system (this is true wealth will always gather in certain people extravagantly). How would wealth be gathered in a resource based economy with no money systems?

5. How is it proposing the same absurdities as the new age movement when these ideas predate all orthodox religeons and new age movements if you just look at ONLY what the guy is saying?

the red pill and been totally zeisted by the giest!

Imagine a world...we'll call it Zeitopia. Zeitopia was formed from the ashes of the ruins of the 21st century Earth. In its infancy the founders of Zeitopia managed to survey the entire planet, locate, access, and quantify all of the planet's resources, including it's potential for sustainable energy (wind, solar, geothermal, temperature differential, etc...) And now all the children of the earth share in this quantification. They need not work, they simply volunteer their efforts, they are serviced in the majority of their needs by machines and robots. It is, for lack of a better word, ideal. No one frets over loss of property, or ownership, for anything can be replenished with the proper application of quantification, for there is no allowance of scarcity in this society. Zeitopia is almost a living organism in itself.

Wow. Unfortunately, that's what the pamphlet says. The truth is that in the initial survey, they held back resources twice as much for themselves as for others. They cooked the books so to say from the start. Not only that, but the central computer that tracks all of the resource usages system wide is run by a fellow who just had a nasty divorce, apparently his wife was allocating her resources pretty evenly aournd the neighboorhood. So he's pissed. So he has been tampering with the allocations the computer provides to those fresh neighboors of his. But, what the heck, it's kind of fun sometimes. Also, in Zeitopia, it's not that anyone would come get you for not showing up to that voluntary solar panel modificaton class you participate in, but that one time you stopped participating for a week everyone kind of looked at you funny, you even heard people asking if you still got your allowances of resources since they covered for you during a really busy time. But, hey at least you've been able to disguise your inordinate resource usage with that cool gizmo you got from your old school buddy. You'd never have been able to get away with the total waste of water and good clean oxygen without it. But, you did have to trade away a week's worth of food stuffs to get it. Oh, well...

Money is not the root of evil. Greed is the root of evil. Any system is open to abuse. Any rules are subject to breakage. No rules are subject to one rule. What the anarchists have missed is that the ultimate defense against organization is self reliance. Zeitopia is a world exactly like ours. The same way that National Parks Monoploy is the same game as regular monopoly, the only change is the asthetic, the names and the playing pieces. No rule difference, no change.

Why is Zeitopia no different? Because it still incorporates humans. And no matter how dilligently Joseph Peters and the Venus folks fight aginst human nature, it is still there. I believe that it is stated on the Zeitgiest site that al least 90-95% (possibly even more) of our actions in this life are learned, conditioned. That would put a tiny majority of our life under the control of instinct. Well, I won't argue that we aren't part of our society, that society acts to corall its members into some similarity. Funny that they all do that isn't it. Do you think it's instinct for people to be social like that, to not want to be ostracised? Here's a little experiment. Get a friend in a parking lot and engage them in a deeply intellectual conversation. Have another friend drive toward you so that your buddy you are conversing with cannot see. Slam on the breaks 10 feet away and watch what happens. The flinch, the jump, the fear, the inability to return directly to that intellectual conversation, the adrenaline. Survival is an instinct, it's not something you are conditioned to. It rules over ALL conditions when activated.

Why would a man steal from another, commit a crime against another. For scarcity? that condition could certainly lead to crime. People kill each other in war who would otherwise be friends. The condition of war provides that horrible situation. But why steal or kill in the situation? Because below it all is survival. Not a condition, a necessity, an instinct below all others, a bedrock. Humans are marvelous creatures because we can rise above our need solely to survive, but instigate the need to survive, and you will find a very different man. Yes conditions can instigate instincts, or appease them, but Zeitgiest is very wrong to believe that simply changing the clothes on the structure is a change to the structure at all.

If you believe that we are all just our experiences, go read some Oliver Sacks. You cannot condition out instincts, you may tame it, it may become latent, but it will not die. Zietopia fights our instinct to survive of our own accord. This world at present does as well. Why, because a few surveyed the earth, recognized the resources, catalouged them, quantified them and took more for themselves than others. They convinced us that their resources were those necessary for proper society and we bit. Do you see? Zeitopia is a leap from here to there, but all we get is new clothes, and words.

Nothing systematically changes. You may say well everyone has everything. Well, all I have right now is tied up insomeone else's house who has all their stuff tied up in another's car, don't we all each have everything right now through ouur present system? Zeitopia is open to abuses. It is open to the exploitation of the very resources it seeks to protect. It has no checks and balances in place. It is just like now. It is not the future, it is a retelling of the present. It is the social scientists vision of the ages, and it is fraught with human frailty, for all it's intention, it is a failure of the human imagination. Why? Because it sees only the symptoms of "Now" and sets its sights on solving those. It is as typical as taking cold medicine; it will not heal the cold, only alleviate the symptopms.

Why is this? Because it does not address human instincts. It hides them like the frosting on a layer cake. It is too much technology, and too little understanding. OH, but they have science! What if Newton wouldn't have used his intuition when he saw that apple fall. He knew what he was looking for before he ran the tests. The scientific method is only useful after the spark of intuition has been lit. And what does the scientific method prove? Solely this; that the mind of man is far more diligent in its understanding of this world than is our philosophy of it, or of ourselves. The method may prove out some misgotten relationship, but the method itself, is a creaton of inspiration as well. Our instincts, will forever outpace our condition, and do our instincts ever really change?

The reality is that Zeitopia is a pipe dream. It has inherent in its supposition as much individual sovereignty as our present condition; very little. I propose, as do many DPers that we move backward this opportunity, instead of forward. That we readdress where all the sovereignty we expect has really gone. I suggest that we will find our future in our past, a future that is truly worth the struggle, a future of rights inalienable, instead of another system of pleasure and privledge proscribed.

Lastly, I believe that this response answers all of your questions, save religion, because it addresses the fundamental current of them all. And that fundamental current is a supposition on your part, that Zeitopia is worth pursuing. My position is the very oposite. Zeitopia is not the "holy grail", it is just a myth, built upon another failing myth. The only system surviving at present is sovereignty. The only people who will survive to create ANY new world will be those who are self reliant. Sovereignty is the key, and again it is the answer to ALL your questions.

Assert Your Authority