If The Revolution had an Army of soldiers fighting for it, would you back them?
Posted November 23rd, 2008 by tog2476
output
The answer is we do, but the questions still remains would you? Forget about Ron Paul, love him, respect him, appreciate him,and be grateful for what he is, and what he was, and what he will become for us in the future. It is not his turn anymore, it is ours. He handed it over to us. While there are some that will continue to stomp the streets, and make signs, and protest and march, there are some and will be more that fall into the hands of apathy. Hoping that this keyboard they are typing on will somehow save the world. Now don't go bitching at me for having the gall to say this stuff like I am calling us apathetic, and lazy- but I am. There is not much fire left in many of you. It is like you built this whole foundation on Ron Paul and now your house has fallen over and you are sitting in the middle of it wasting away. We don't need Ron Paul to have a Revolution, he did a hell of a job starting it, and now the torch is ours. Yes, there is a lot of good proactivity going on, but twenty people at a protest for the Federal Reserve is hardly what I would call a good turnout for a city. I would rather be a sheeple than be an awakened one with my hands and mind tied to failure, and that is what many have become. There is a group of veterans working for us, bleeding for us, risking jail for us, and all I see half the time on here is about the other sides activities, how they are screwing us. What about some posts about how we are gonna, or how we can screw them. Are we defeatists or opportunists? www.veteransforpeace.org has veterans, people who know how to get stuff done, and are willing to risk their asses to do so, and we just bump a thread or write a comment saying thank you patriots, or we don't write a post at all and just let it fade away. We would rather tell people about how long you can keep chicken in a fridge before it goes bad. Iraq Vets Against the War (link please) and www.veteransforpeace.org have people who know and are practiced in the art of offensive and defensive combat, and we sit here and wonder what the hell we can do. They have shown they are willing to put their necks out, and we say holy crap, "How long can a chicken last in the fridge?'' Where the hell is the Revolution, where is the money, where is the sweat, where is the movement? Can we rally behind something once again, or should we wave the white flag? These veterans should be getting our attention, not Obama, not Palin, not the Bildebergs, not Bob Barr and the shit he is spewing. Who gives a shit what Obama says, or Palin, or Barr. Who gives a shit about the Rothchilds or The Federal Reserve. Do you think they are gonna stop moving toward their goals because we are interested in what the hell they are doing? We need to get interested in what we are doing, and focus on that, because that is what they are doing against us. Determination is what wins, hesitation is what loses. We need to back groups that are already organized and on the war front. Do the tanks being made in the factories inflict more damage than the ones already on the battlefield? I think not, lets put our focus and efforts into the tanks that are already in the battlefield. www.veteransforpeace.org, www.ivaw.org. They are charging forward, are we?
Bookmark/Search this post with:
How about some
proactivity?
Hello
everyone.
I agree with supporting these Vets
They are showing a leadership role in activism and growing thier voice and numbers! We do need to support them!
But we must all take personal responsibility at the same time!
see this thread Patriot Wheels :
http://www.dailypaul.com/...
There are many fronts that need fighting! That said, I dont think we will get united by any single ONE being as scattered as we are ...we will pick away at the NWO in many directions!!
When the time is right a call for massive action focused on one effort will be answered! I know it will ...just remember we are not alone here on DP there are many other fronts taking place..be it local politics, national, militias, liberty minded citizen groups, so many freedom and liberty organizations some new and some very established!
************
"Thomas Jefferson is rolling in his grave fast enough to be a new source of energy independence."~ samthurston
http://www.campaignforlib...
Who else is as organized and ready to roll as these
two groups, we certainly cannot come together on a plan, the best plan would be to back these veteran's plans.
Agreed
-These guys deserve our support.
-------------------
"I killed the Bank."
they have no morals
Should they feel threatened to completely lose power they will nuke us or something of that sort. They have no conscience.
That is what bothers me.
Like I've said, if they can murder 3000 citizens for personal agenda and gain and get away with it.. Imagine how cocky they are and what they would do if they really felt threatened.
everyone will have his day to
die.
Yes, these folks are more likened to cold 'lizards' than human
beings. They would have to be ruthless and soulless to do the things they did and continue to do.
When push comes to shove, many of us in this movement may in fact perish as a result of our being 'Constitutionalists', but it is either that or this country, indeed the entire world, will be 'their' perpetual slaves. I will risk my life rather than be a slave any day!
In response to the growing calls for armed revolution…
I see three underlying problems in our movement. 1. We are too spread-out over the country to act with any kind of precision. 2. We lack direction and leadership. 3. We lack political voice and force. The third issue mentioned is a result of the first two.
Like most of you I truly recognize the abject hopelessness that comes from watching the current events unfold before us, knowing what is coming, but unable to stop or affect it all. We are fighting a beast that has had decades—nay centuries –to foster its plans against us and we are just waking up.
Two central tenants of warfare are to not fight on your opponents ground nor to play to his strength. Lashing out, as disparate leaderless groups, will do exactly that; play to the beast’s strength. This monster has at its disposal the FBI, INTERPOL, the Patriot Act, the CIA, and all other manners of evil and oppression to round up those dissidents they find here and there to cut them off from the people and the message. What good does it do us to get the few enlightened leaders we do have arrested or worse?
Let us look to the founders for guidance then.
They organized into legitimate state legislatures and operated within English law to plead for their rights under the Magna Carta and English Common Law. They drafted and published statements over a long period of time, which both asserted their trampled rights and gave due process to the King should stronger action ever become necessary. Yes, there was also some civil disobedience like the tea party and it’s like but those were the exclamation points on long attempts to legally sue for redress not the central focus of their movement. Had Jefferson, Washington, and Franklin merely ran around inciting riots and revolution they would have been arrested and executed before there could have even been one. And make no mistake, the founders did not start the war even if they did foment the Revolution. The British started the war by firing on our militia at Lexington. At any time prior to that, the King could have relaxed the heavy hand of his government and the revolution would never have been.
We need to follow their example and work within the Constitution to assert the sovereign rights of our states. To do this we need to take over the state legislatures with citizen politicians that think the way we do. To get those people elected in large enough numbers to have an influence on the legislatures we need to concentrate our numbers in a few conservative/libertarian leaning states. This might mean that many of us have to consider a move away from our traditional homes to settle some place where we can have a greater effect. Small state races can be dominated by an energized minority, which will quickly turn into a buzzing majority.
Once we have a couple of state legislatures moving the right way we can pass legislation like Oklahoma just did asserting itself by standing up to un-funded congressional mandates. From there we can initiate legislation to fund value backed competing currencies to the dollar. The Constitution allows states to make gold and silver legal tender and there is legal precedent for such a move. We can use the force of law to stop the heavy hand of the federal government at the boarders of our states and in the courtrooms. Of course, we must do more. We also have to be willing to get up off our couches and computers and get into fighting shape. As newly elected legislators, we must encourage and foster stronger state militias. Because when we begin asserting our state’s sovereignty, legally or not, the federal government will face a choice. It can begin to retract into the constitutional republic it was meant to be, or like King George, it can start a war that we may then have to finish.
I propose that we all look hard at some states that are already moving in the right direction. States like Oklahoma which just elected a Republican majority in its state Senate for the first time in its history. Oklahoma is wealthy in natural resources and is already drafting legislation to stand up to the rising socialist federal government. Also, states like Texas which have access to the gulf and have stood up to the trans-Texas corridor. I’m sure there are others but the population base will also be a factor. Over-populous states will be hard to outvote…although if they are already leaning the right way then they may be easier to wake up as well.
Once we have identified these places we move there and we get active and stay active in local politics. There are many freedom fighters in these state legislatures that have been fighting this fight alone and they will be all to friendly to re-enforcements from us finally showing up!
I understand your frustration but let us do this the right way, the legal way, the constitutional way…the way our founders did. If there is fighting to be done beyond the rotunda and the courtroom, let’s make the fed fire the first shot…and be ready for them when they do.
RJ Harris
Norman, OK
18 year veteran of the milita
Law Student and future state of Oklahoma Legislator
PS I truly believe that if we can get one or two states moving in the right direction, other states will follow our lead.
Strength and Honor
United We Stand Divided We Fall
I have not posted here for a while because the people here are so divided. There are still people that beleive this all can be settled in a peaceful manor by donating money to elect officials that we beleive will fight for our freedom. This approach might work in another hundred years if we lived in a system that follows the Constitution. I think we can all agree that this is not the way our system works any longer. Donating money is fine if that is the way you wish to help but I for one have no more money to donate and I for one think that we have already donated enough or we were robbed enough money to support our failing governmental system. We must UNITE.... We do not have to wait til 2012 to re-elect. Our Constitution grants us the people the right to remove ( throw the hell out)
the officials who no longer serve the people or have commited crimes against our Constitution. We all know they have commited numerous crimes against our Constitution. In our forefathers day, treason was punishable by hanging... These bastards are already 47 steps ahead of us. The time for peaceful resolution is past... Would it not be a glorious entry in our great great grandchildrens history books about how the people once again United to regain our FREEDOM
PS. To answer the question If I would fight for the Revolution? I will say this, I await for the ranks to assemble...
**************************************************
Only as a free man shall I perish...
Well thats' nice, dozer001, I await too. The crazy thing about
this is why do I sense I am being played like a mouse by the big cat?
Don't you see we have a big big country with 300million people here. About 30-40 percent maybe would be willing to 'storm the Bastille' so to speak, but how do we do that without being wiped out? "Hey, riot police, wanna join us to take back our country?" How much you being paid?
Its like this is all driving me crazy being a arm chair 'revolutionary' without being able to channel my intentions to restore our republic. While the Obama administration unfolds its intentions for what is coming, I feel I am a prisoner watching helplessly out my window. Its just driving me crazy!
You have to think like them. When I imagine the question coming up in their secret meetings, "Well what if the people decide to take back their country on their own then what? "Oh I wouldn't worry too much about that. We'll have everything in place by then, keep in mind if the illiteracy and dumbing down has worked like we believe it has no other way but working, then I wouldn't worry too much about it. They simply cannot do a thing. They will have to succumb or else......"
As much as I hate to imagine this, it is there and no denying it. It behooves me to wonder what shall we all do? Yes, it is 'safe' here on a site like this to 'share' stuff with others, yet it is true, time ticks by and still what do we do?
First Thing to do Anisha
is to take a nice deep slow breath ---- I also feel the anguish that you and MANY other Americans feel for our country, our people, our freedom and our Constitution. Do not feel like a mouse being played with by the cat, instead feel like a flea on the cats back. One flea can cause an itch but many fleas can bring the cat to its demise. We must unite to prevail but I fear it will have to get much worse for people to finally open their eyes. It will take mass people starving in the streets, people who have nothing else to loose before real change happens. There are links in the posts on this page that would allow you to help some of the organizations such as the Vets etc. .. I am sorry I have no real answers for you. I am more the survivalist warrior type person, When the fighting begins, I will be there.
**************************************************
Only as a free man shall I perish...
OK dozer, I took some deep breaths.
I love your idea of the fleas, yes, I see what you mean, thank you.
I share your thinking that this country will have to experience severe suffering before what is left of our citizens will appreciate the inheritance they forgot.
Someone, I think Colognepaulist, brought up the idea of creating a worldwide fellowship of the White Rose. The same underground that took down the Nazi regime in occupied France. What do you think about such an organization?
These groups
are the Revolution, they are the sweating, bleeding, motivated, non stop ass stomping veterans who believe in what they are doing. They believe, when you believe, you will either recieve victory or death. I think they are willing to be handed either. That is enough for me to put my money where my mouth is. Believing is 90% of the battle, the other 10% is luck.
From the looks of things
you may be in the minority here. How much more needs to happen before there is a response? How much? When millions more are dead? When we have NO money left to buy guns and ammo?
The 10% your reference is what I would like to address.
I don't believe in luck, good or bad. It's all in the preparation. When you are better prepared, you have better outcomes - thus the opposite is true for bad outcomes. When THEIR preparation is below standard, your outcome is better. See the insight here?
ALWAYS give your self credit for good outcomes - luck has nothing to do with it!
We are tying eachothers hands up
because like me, I feel very motivated still about the message, but when I see everyone on here so disheartened and looking at the negative, it gets so frustrating, and not in a pansy way it almost makes me feel isolated and alone in the cause of freedom. We cannot do this without motivating eachother, and staying positive. Yes bad shit is occuring everyday from the powers that be, but we have to choose where to put our focus. Are we going to focus on the problems or the solutions. The group that I can see right now being most effective, and holding the fire is these two groups, so if we have no fire left, or an isolated ability to spread the fire, we need to back the groups that still have some bullets left so to speak. Thank you for all the nice comments below, that is what I mean by motivation. We can all do things everyday that will forward the message without causing us to drastically change our lives. Life is crammed full right now for all of us, a little bit everyday will go a long way. If we could even all pledge $20 a month a piece, I am sure it would help. I am totally hip to the idea of a money bomb for these guys, not in one week, but a month away- so we can energize it and spread the word to every Ron Paul supporter we know. Jdayh, it might be time for a meetup mass email to let people know who we are going to organize behind at this stage in the game. You are the meetup email master, what do you think?
how about a money bomb
for adam and the boys?
Tog
I pretty much agree with your post, but I don't think most here are apathetic. The apathetic ones are the ones that don't even come here anymore. A lot of regular posters are completely gone. Then there are people like my friend who was a big RP supporter and ended up voting for Obama. I still can't reconcile that one. I thought she was wide awake and then I find that out. When I found out last week (she was scared to tell me) she said "well you don't think he's really that bad, do you? Not as bad as McCain, right?" I'm still picking my jaw up off the ground.
I also have some questions on these 2 groups. Adam Kokesh is obviously fighting for liberty, but are most of these guys? I would bet that alot of these IVAW guys voted for Obama because they think he'll end the War. Do most of them know who the real enemies of liberty are? Maybe I'm wrong. I hope I am.
That's a brain squisher.
I can't figure that one either...how can one understand the truth and then support evil? It does hurt my brain and makes me feel hopeless.
bump
Oath before orders - thank you!
(Is there an emoticon for a standing ovation?)
Please note my morning rant... "So little time left, lets use it wisely."
You bring up a point I neglected, regarding the BRAVEST OF THE BRAVE - the SOLDIERS who are putting their OATH ahead of ORDERS.
THEY NEED US. Ron Paul does not. He won his seat. He is not even trying to "lead" any more, he is trying to do his job.
Leaders are for SHEEP. Are you a SHEEP? Then stop looking for someone to lead you, get off your ass, and do what you CAN do - whatever tiny thing it may be.
Tog...love the post...
Please update one of you links up top form .com to .org also
here is a link to add for those that just want to donate..
LETS KEEP IT SIMPLE...
https://app.etapestry.com...
Thanks Jdayh
problem corrected.
Jim Sinclair - serious read today
Please pass this on to everyone you care about
http://www.jsmineset.com/
ooops...
Funding a revolution???
Their is no stopping a idea whos time has come. Maybe the first revolution didn't abolish the slave tax through mandate of income tax.. But did you not think that the second coming of souls from that era would allow this to continue?
don't be surprised, you're not alone.
Find out if you have a local militia - http://www.uaff.us/
We need direction. If it will not be Dr. Paul then who?
Who will lead this mobilization amongst our 'people' and to what end? It better be effective whatever this may be because I have a feeling we will only have one shot at this so it better be good.
WE DO NOT NEED "DIRECTION"
We need to ACCEPT PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY.
Honestly, do you REALLY have no idea what you can do TODAY?
The "direction" is toward LIBERTY. Each individual reclaiming their SOVEREIGN SOULS. Send no money, but act today, it is a limited time offer! You only have ONE LIFETIME to figure it out, so ACT NOW!!!
I do not think I need something I already have: Personal
Responsibility. Thats nice but it just isn't enough. I have already done all that I think I can do since the past 18 months right now. I believe we have hit a brick wall. I do not think you understand what I am saying. We most certainly need 'direction' or we are a joke.
When I say direction, I mean direction. Don't be naive about this. Denial will not be a solution. I can only sense that this is like military 101. I am not military, but I know enough to say that that is what military does. It mobilizes organized forces to advance a goal!!!! How that for my description? And I am a woman for God's sake!
What about you military out there. What proposals do you have? I would be interested in knowing just how are we going to take down this monster?????
I say this like I am thinking out loud and this does not mean I am giving in either. I think we ought to think this through and use this site as a think tank for us.
I do accept personal responsibility.
But please, if it's sooooo obvious what we should be doing, please enlighten me. I want to take action, but do need direction. Yes, I can take some steps myself, but none of us can bring down the tyranny alone. I was at the Dallas Fed yesterday and was pretty happy when I got there to see so many people, but the fact is 200 people means there are still sooooooo many that are asleep.
nevermind Paul4Won
just saw your other post
http://www.dailypaul.com/...
got your email...and I will responed shortly...
thanks for "paying attention"
I slip these things in here and there..for If I publicly put up plans..the Moderator would ban me..or at least delete my threads on this issue.
I am curious.(so as to know how much you are aware of the evil thus far of the gov. --the FED-- and the NWO....
how long have you been awake??
I personally found out about the FED almost 15 years ago...fought the IRS and won w/o a lawyer..when I was only 20...(went to tax court and said "BS..I don't owe you a damn thing".. ..hahaha..is was quite funny looking back on it...) wasn't scared..just pissed off....
Thanks Jdayh
Well, I found out about RP about September of 2007 approx. but had no idea at first of the conspiracy. Since then I've been deep down many rabbit holes. I'm an avid reader here on dailypaul and have read or watched watched countless articles, youtubes, movies, etc. I think I have a good understanding on most issues. But I learn more everyday. I'm a homeschooling Mom of two, so I do have the time to do a lot of research.
Alright. I hear you loud and clear. How do we back our
revolutionary soldiers?
What do we do? What is the most effective way of channeling this movement into the biggest, most overwhelming movement in the history of this country? Do I feel it in my bones? Yes. But how?
Do we all link arms and stampede the White House? Do we stampede the House of Reps? And if we did that then what? What will be the point of it all if we do not know what our goal will be? What is our goal?
What shall it be that focuses all of us in a way that takes us to the urban centers across this country not just to protest but effectively takes our power back from the corruption syndicate that controls this system? How do we do that effectively, successfully? Most of us are not military! Most of us wouldn't even know how to shoot a gun!
At the risk of being called a wimp, I would like to know how do we do this?
Those of us who became State and National delegates for Ron Paul were witness to some of the most disgusting, cowardly, traitorous acts of criminality by the State Republican Party central committees! I do not think we will ever forget what and how they rigged the elections from within, but they did it. They pulled it off. So we know the political parties are a sham, so now what is Plan B?
Anisha I sent you and email at contact
Please read it !! and get back to me...
It will answer your questions..and perhaps give you much clarity.
THERE IS A PLAN B...unfortunately to post any knowledge of it here..would get me and the handful that are operating it ..banned..or at the least our threads would be banned.
But if you want in ..or want to find out...read your email.
This quote kind of jumped out at me when I read this post
"Iraq Vets Against the War (link please) and www.veteransforpeace.com have people who know and are practiced in the art of offensive and defensive combat, and we sit here and wonder what the hell we can do. They have shown they are willing to put their necks out,"
How do you support your troops? I think we have to do more than send them cookies.
here is the link.....
https://app.etapestry.com...
If anyone from this group is reading this
the donation choices on your web site need to be fixed. It only now allows donations for the impeachment project, even when I click on the bring them home link.
this one works...
try it...\
https://app.etapestry.com...
I scrolled down to the bottom
and found a link that said "support VFP." It works for online donation. Also has a snail mail address down there. This is a great idea. Let's support these troops.
Bump
Strength and Honor